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Heritage Preservation - 11/15/2010 APPROVED MINUTES EDEN PRAIRIE HERITAGE PRESERVATION COMMISSION MONDAY, NOVEMBER 15, 2010 7:00 P.M. CITY CENTER PRAIRIE ROOMS A&B COMMISSION MEMBERS Ann Higgins, Chairperson; Kathy Veurink, Vice Chairperson; Matthew Fyten,Jeffrey Lawler, Nina Mackay, Mark McPherson, Ed Muehlberg STUDENT REPRESENTATIVE Ian English COMMISSION STAFF John Gertz, Pathfinder CRM, LLC Lori Creamer, Recorder I. ROLL CALL Higgins called the meeting to order at 7:00 p.m. Commissioner Muehlberg excused, Mackay and Veurink absent. Jan Mosman from the Eden Prairie Historical Society was in attendance. II. APPROVAL OF AGENDA MOTION: Lawler moved, seconded by Fyten to approve the agenda. Motion Carried 4-0. III. APPROVAL OF MINUTES A. COMMISSION MEETING HELD OCTOBER 18, 2010 MOTION: McPherson moved, seconded by Lawler to approve the minutes of the Heritage Preservation Commission meeting held on October 18, 2010 with the following corrections: Page 1, item VL —New Business item A replace "OD" with"OF"; Page 2, paragraph 2, replace "Commissioner Muehlberg" with"Commissioner McPherson"; Page 3, first paragraph replace"Commissioner Muehlberg" with"Commissioner McPherson"; Page 3 VII—New Business item B third paragraph replace "Muehlberg" with"McPherson" Motion carried 4-0. MOTION: Fyten moved, seconded by Lawler to accept the amended minutes. Motion Carried 4-0. English stated the wording on page 3, item C,paragraph 3 was confusing. HERITAGE PRESERVATION COMMISSION MINUTES November 15, 2010 Page 2 Page 3 item C paragraph 3 should read "Gertz stated he would provide the HPC Commissioner Manual to city staff to provide access to the manual from the HPC webpage." MOTION: Lawler moved, seconded by Fyten to approve the corrected amended minutes. Motion Carried 4-0. IV. REPORTS OF COMMISSION AND STAFF A. UPDATE ON EDEN PRAIRIE HISTORICAL SOCIETY PROJECTS Jan Mosman, vice chair of the Eden Prairie Historical Society, gave an update on the progress of the projects at the Cummins Grill House. The city has rebuilt the outhouse and demolished the shed down by the peony garden. The reusable wood was saved. There were some interesting artifacts found that were saved as well. The large shed on the north east corner of the property has been wrapped and tied for the winter. The city placed plastic around the entire building and nailed boards to hold it in place. Sticha said they are waiting until spring to do work on the milk house. The Historical Society has requested bids for electrical work in the kitchen and hired hands room as well as plaster repair and painting. They have received two estimates for re-doing the cobblestone pavers by the peony parlor and south entrance to the dining room. Kevin Schmieg has been consulted and he is comfortable with the bid from the plumber and utility contractor. We would like to get the utilities in before the ground freezes. This general contractor has previously done work at the site. Historical Society is working with the city cooperatively on the pricing of plaster and painting through the contractor who does that work at the city facilities. December 1st there will be a social women's event at the house with Marshall Farms providing the seasonal decorations. Higgins mentioned receiving an e-mail from the decorating committee to invite the HPC members to help is they so choose. Gertz asked Mosman if she meant cobblestone literally or was she talking about replacing the current cobblestone with new pavers. Mosman said they would be new pavers. Gertz suggested taking a look at an old photo of what the original pavers looked like. The photos were donated by the Grill family and should be in the archives. Gertz stated the updates should consist of reclaimed, not modern pavers and made of clay not cement. Gertz will provide names of companies that stock pile old pavers. Lawler said he knew of an old clay paver's junkyard in Minneapolis. Mosman stated they had talked about using reclaimed, one level pavers which would be more accessible and safer than the one wiggly stone step that is in place today. Mosman asked if they could put in a ramp instead of a step,ramping down from the cobblestone. Gertz stated the bigger issue for the commission would this be considered a minor or major alteration. If it is for safety, trying to make a step would be a better alternative because ramps were not common back them. HERITAGE PRESERVATION COMMISSION MINUTES November 15, 2010 Page 3 Make sure the level endings are consistent with the risers, and that it meets the required code. Be consistent around the house. The big stones were found on the property and placed by the house. The stones themselves have no significance to the property. Mosman asked if they embedded the stone into a concrete step and level it out so it would be safer for visitors, if that would be acceptable? Lawler offered the suggestion to have it more authentic by putting a bed on small rock around the large stone making it sturdier. Mosman again stated her concern for safety. People have fallen and older people are stumbling and falling, it is a real safety concern. Gertz said it was ok to go and look at pavers,but nothing fancy. Make sure the pattern would be something that may have been used in that time frame. Mosman said she loves the old stones; her concern is the property is city owned and is open to the public and the possible liability this may cause. It is not well lit either, which is another issue. Would it be possible to put railings by the entrances for safety reasons? Gertz replied railings on the exterior would not be appropriate for the historic value. He would like the commission to think about that further and bring it back for discussion at a later date. Maybe it's the lack of lighting that needs to be addressed before deciding to install hand rails. Mosman stated they could have the original outside lights installed for safety. McPherson added if a railing is required by code, he would rather not have it attached to the house. Gertz didn't think this situation would require a railing to meet code. I'd focus on the lights for right now. Mosman said they have received complaints that there aren't railings near all of the entrances with steps. Higgins suggested looking at each event and having enough volunteers there to help people who need it. English added the possibility of hanging "watch your step" signs to release liability. Mosman said they would skip the railing project for now and focus on the lighting and the stone issues first. Concrete step as opposed to a stone that would be the safest similar to what comes off the porch from the kitchen door. The two places where we will need them are by the peony garden and the driveway on the L shape. If we eliminated the stones, stepping onto the ground would be safer. McPherson suggested before the commission makes a motion to go ahead with this project, we would like to see the photo which shows the cobblestone at its original state and a sample of paver that will replace the original ones. Gertz said he wanted to make sure there was no confusion relating to him authorizing anything on the exterior of the building without any discussion with the city staff and commission. Mosman said because of the photo's that is what was meant by oking it? Gertz stated those group of projects are not considered minor work. McPherson said the end result must resemble what was in the photos. Mosman asked if they could get HPC's approval for just the portion of swapping of materials (flagstone to pavers) and not do anything with the steps before next spring. We have to accomplish some things to show the city council we are making improvements and this seems like the logical step. Higgins asked what the process is in which the HPC has to follow. Gertz replied first the commission has to determine if it's a minor or major alteration. Higgins stated since we didn't have any knowledge of this prior to the meeting, it is a little constraining to have to make a decision tonight without any samples of the product to be used. Lawler agreed having a sample of the paver and/or a picture of what is being proposed would have been better in order to make a decision. Fyten concurred with Lawler stating he was ok with moving HERITAGE PRESERVATION COMMISSION MINUTES November 15, 2010 Page 4 forward with the paver idea but needed more specific information to make a decision. Gertz talked about other projects on the table may need to go through the council process and wondered what other projects the historical society had in mind. If the HPC can be given the information on upcoming projects in a timely manner, then it can be determined which projects will need council approval to proceed. Mosman said she would take this information to the board and task force and get back to the commission. Higgins asked if the historical society had been given a timetable in which to complete this project? Mosman replied the only time limitation is to replace the pavers before the ground freezes as it is difficult to do the work in January or February. Higgins stated there were two verbal reservations plus herself not having an indication on making a decision tonight. Mosman said when she talked with John about the pavers, she understood they would be appropriate and we were going ahead with the process. Lawler asked if we don't make a decision tonight or the correct recycled pavers are unable to be located, what is plan B. Mosman said they would do nothing. Gertz commented even if the photo was found, it would not show the detail, it would only show they were there. Other options are to wait, get more information from Jan and discuss at next month's meeting or hold a special meeting to decide if it's indeed a minor alteration. McPherson suggested we approve it, pending photo and other information if pavers are available. Gertz stated if it is a minor alteration, staff can approve it or we can bring it back to the commission. I would make recommendations, not final approval. It's up to you, do you want staff to make the determination if it's a minor or major alteration. McPherson added he didn't think it should go back to the staff, because that is what we are here for. Mosman said she would gather the old photo and sample of pavers for the staff to be able to make a determination. Higgins said we need a motion to direct staff to work with the Historical Society to move ahead. We would like samples of the pavers at the December meeting. Lawler stated he was not ready to make a motion. Fyten said he is fine calling it a minor alteration;however, it seems strange to come back in December to see what staff decided. Higgins asked if we give approval for staff to move forward with conditions and staff has authority to not proceed if they are not satisfied with the paver choice. English suggested holding an additional meeting to see the samples and make a decision based on that. Mosman said she would get photos and samples to staff before they were purchased for approval. No work would be done until the product was approved. Gertz stated again the problem is still if it is a minor or major alteration until they have seen the products and a plan of what work will be done. MOTION: Fyten moved, seconded by McPherson to direct staff to proceed with historical society in which the historical society will provide photos and samples of pavers to staff. Staff will distribute copies of materials received from the historical society to commission members individually. Each commissioner is to comment directly to staff or John, and not communicate with each other on this matter. Motion Carried 4-0. B. 2011 MEETING SCHEDULE HERITAGE PRESERVATION COMMISSION MINUTES November 15, 2010 Page 5 The regularly scheduled commission meeting in January falls on the Martin Luther King Day holiday and the February meeting falls on Presidents Day, the commission decided to hold the January meeting on the 24th and the February meeting on the 28th. They chose March 1st for the date to make a presentation to the city council. An updated 2011 meeting schedule will be distributed to commission members at the next meeting. V. OLD BUSINESS A. UPDATE ON THE JOHN R. CUMMINS HOMESTEAD LANDSCAPE RESTORATION AND OUTBUILDINGS Gertz worked with the contractor on the outhouse project which is almost complete. It's on the new slab and the structure was replaced and the roof rebuilt. A tarp was placed over the old granary. Wood from the peony garden shed was salvaged along with the nails and full dimensional siding. There were some artifacts that were found on the property which should be brought in for the winter. Gertz will talk with city staff to see if someone can go out to the house and put those artifacts into the building. Higgins stated work on the fence should be done before winter. B. HPC COMMISSIONER'S INFORMATION PACKET DISCUSSION Nothing reported. C. UPDATE ON WEBSITE ITEMS Higgins would talk with city staff and work with students at Eden Prairie High School to come up with a solution. Lawler asked who is doing the historical society website. Mosman responded it is a work in progress, but Jim Clark has made a Facebook page which helps get the word out about upcoming events as well as photos. He is pulling us into modern times. Lawler suggested the HPC and historical websites should have links to each other to build up traffic and be more streamlined. It would also show the HPC's site is valuable. D. SMITH-DOUGLAS-MORE PROPERTY—REMOVAL OF DEAD TREES Higgins reported Kathie Case had some concerns that Ann Shuster didn't know about the removal. At our last meeting Stu Fox talked about his meeting with Ann and let her know those trees needed to come down. Staff also removed vegetation from the shed. We pushed to have staff do something right away. Mosman said it was a very long process. Gertz added he and the city staff went out to the city properties to access them to see what kind of maintenance issues need to be done. Request from Paul Sticha or Jay HERITAGE PRESERVATION COMMISSION MINUTES November 15, 2010 Page 6 Lotthammer a list of upcoming projects, so you will have a heads up as to what they will be doing. VI. NEW BUSINESS A. FINDINGS OF SIGNIFICANCE FOR DORENKEMPER LOG HOUSE Gertz stated moving this house towards local designation is the first step. There is a specific process and information that needs to be gathered in order for the property to be issued a site number. The commission's job is to look at the criteria and see how this property meets any of the findings. First part is to determine the significance, steps down the road would be determining the integrity of the building and proposed boundary. It is possible the one that is already in place for the Riley Farmstead would be acceptable for this project. Gertz will get copies of the context report for each commission member which contains the criteria to be considered. English asked if there were any other log homes in Eden Prairie. Gertz responded there are none that are designated, however, there is one private home made of logs which is still a functioning residence. MOTION: McPherson moved, seconded by Lawler to adopt the findings of significance dated November 15, 2010 for the Dorenkemper house and recommend the property be designated a local heritage preservation site. Motion Carried 4-0. B. RAMUS BARN Kipp indicated the purchase agreement has not been signed. Discussions are being done as to how the property will be divided and how the new owner obtains access from Pioneer Trail. Kipp indicated he would keep the commission updated as to the progress. C. SECTION 106 HISTORIC REVIEW OF SOUTHWEST TRANSIT WAY PROJECT Gertz met with the Southwest Transit to find out if any of the proposed sites bump up against historic sites in Eden Prairie. The city and HPC members have been invited to participate in this process. Gertz was planning on attending the meetings, which the dates have not been determined as of yet. Higgins can decide if she wants to participate as well as any other commission members. Gertz would represent the city as a consultant along with other participants including but not limited to MnDOT, SHPO, Hennepin County, Archaeological team, City of Minneapolis. The meetings would consist of reviewing plans for the alignment and any properties the archeological team has uncovered. If there is property affected by this project, it would end up in a 106 review. HERITAGE PRESERVATION COMMISSION MINUTES November 15, 2010 Page 7 Higgins asked if there were commission members interested in participating in this process. There was interest from the members in attendance. VII. ADJOURNMENT MOTION: Lawler moved, seconded by Fyten to adjourn the meeting. Motion carried 4-0. Higgins adjourned the meeting at 9:10 p.m.