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Parks and Recreation - 07/18/1977 1977 JULY 18 MINUTES CITY OF EDEN PRAIRIE AGENDA EDEN PRAIRIE PARKS, RECREATION AND NATURAL RESOURCES COMMISSION MONDAY, JULY 18, 1977 7:30 P.M. , CITY HALL COMMISSION STAFF: Richard Anderson, Steve Fifield, William Garens, Jerry Kingrey, Robert Kruell , Randy Retterath, Mary Upton COMMISSION STAFF: Marty Jessen, Director of Community Services Approx. Time to Begin Item 7:30 I. ROLL CALL II . APPROVAL OF AGENDA III . MINUTES OF JUNE 20, 1977 MEETING IV. PETITIONS, REQUESTS, AND COMMUNICATIONS 7:45 A. Communication from Mary Beth Buckman & Diana Pauling Concerning the Preserve Park Plan 7:55 B. Request by Bob Gartner for Lake Au ementation System V. RECOMMENDATIONS AND REPORTS A. Reports of Commissioners 1. B. Reports of Sta•Ff 8:15 1. Eden Prairie Equestrian Center Lease 8:25 2. Summer Registration Recap 8:20 3. .1977-78 Park Development Program VI. OLD BUSINESS 8:45 A. Park Dedication Requirements--CASH PARK FEE 9:00 B. Commission Goals r _ ;i Parks Recreation and -2- Mon. , July 18-77 Natural Resources Commission VII . NEW BUSINESS A. Discussion of Potential Impact 9:15 of "Year-Round' School on City Recreation Program 9:30 B. Riley Creek - Land for Sale 9:45 VIII . ADJOURNMENT w l APPROVED C 13NUTES PARKS, RECPEATION AND NATURAL RESOURCES COMMISSION MONDAY, JULY 18, 1977 7:30 PM, CITY HALL MEMBERS PRESENT: Chairman Richard Anderson, Robert Kruell., Wiliam Garens, Steve Fifield, Mary Upton, and Randy Retterath MEMBERS EXCUSED: Jerry Kingrey STAFF PRESENT: Marty Jessen, Director of Community Services OTHERS PRESENT: George Bentley, Mary B. Buckman, Mr. & Mrs. Mike Pauling, Mr. & Mrs. John Retterath Chairman Anderson called the meeting to order at 7:35 -FM. II. APPROVAL OF AGENDA Addition of V.A.l. Letter received from City of 10=etonk - Anderson " 11 VII.C. Staffing of Preserve Pool - Retterath of " " D. Dutch EUxn ol Contr Responsibility - Kruell it I1 E. Park PlanninP - Kruell F. Mitchell Lake - Kruell MOTION: Retterath moved to accept Agenda as amended and published, seconded by Upton. Motion carried unanimously. III. MINUTES OF JUNE 20. =7 MEETING i Pg. 7, para. 2, sent. 3, delete "parking"; add "tot". " 8, " 7, sent. 3, add "area" after"District". G r t MOTION: Retterath moved to accept Minutes of June 20, 1977 meeting as published and amended, seconded by Upton. Motion carried, with absentions by Garens and Fifield. s. IV. PETITIONS. REQUESTS, AND COMMUNICATION A. Communication from Mary Beth Buckman_ & Diana Paulin Cggeo ni nethg Preserve Park Plan r Jessen spoke to the meeting held at the Preserve Center on June 21st between Staff members and concerned residents of the Preserve to further review all aspeots of the park development planning there for 1977,and to advise them of the expanded opportunities which are available in conjunction with the CETA grant. , Minutes - Parks, Rec. and approved Natural Resources Commission - 2 - Monday, July 18, 1977 Mary Buckman, 10990 Northmark Dr., spoke to the Open Letter to the Council and PR & NR Commission and signatures of 130 residents, who wished to ex- press their support for the park plan in the Preserve in a positive way. She requested saving any further comments until the CETA grant portion of the Agenda was being discussed. V.B.3. a977-78 Park Development- Program Jessen spoke to the Park Development Program in conjunction with CETA Grant report of July 15th, and the deletion of two projects (no.12-Co. 1 Bikeway- Hikeway and No. 15-Duck Laks Trail Bikeway/Hikeway) because of the lack of sufficient funding to accomplish all of the projects listed on the report. He explained that additional development is possible at the Preserve and Edenvale park sites because of the labor intensive nature of the CETA Pro- ject, and that as a result of Council action, based on the recommendation of the PR & NR Commission, there is $28,700 available for the Preserve. t He spoke to site plan 2 and the advantages, and felt it could be accomplished. Kruell inquired about the Preserve vote on the past bond issue. Jessen res- ponded that he could only speak to that precinct, and that as accurately as he could remember the totals were close in all of the precincts as far as rejecting the bond issue. Jessen responded to questions by the Commissioners such asstiming of installs- tion of irrigation - funds not available until the next year; development of fields - backstops and players benches would be installed; orientation of the fields - He and Enger felt the position would be acceptable; and size of hockey rink - 85' by 1851, which Jessen said was smaller than regulation size, but it was more suited to the age groups that would be playing hockey. Diane Pauling, 10805 Northmark Dr., asked what the Commission saw as being completed in their park during the next year. Jessen explained that what was discussed at the Preserve meeting such as the grading for the entire site by late Fall; backstops and ballfields would be completed, including the seeding and fertilization for this year; minimum developed parking lot (not blacktopped); playground structure; Xighted skating facility; and renovation of the barn or construction of a free standing warming house. Kruell asked whether any part of the land was flood plain. Jessen ex- r plained that it originally was wet but filled in by the Preserve, with about four acres that would be & storm water pond near the school. He ., said it was not defined as flood plain land. Mrs. Pauling added that there is water now, with about forty ducks inhabiting the pond. Kruell inquired whether support could be obtained from that area for the next bond issue, if all of this was accomplished. Ilse; Buckman responded that she could not speak for all of the residents who signed the letter submitted tonight, but it was her opinion that they would like to see► that area stay in its natural state, but that if it was to be a park, they would like to see that it is the best possible park. l Jessen responded to the question by Mrs. Pauling concerning why their park would receive this money, explaining that according to the federal law governing this grant, certain requirements have to be met in order to be eligible, and the Preserve and Edenvale meet these requirements. Minutes - Parks, Rec. and approved Natural Resources Commission - 3 - Monday, July 18, 1977 He further explained that one of these requirements puts priority on the low and middle income housing opportunities, which are present 6nly in the Preserve and Edenvale. Mr. John Retterath, 9011 High Point Circle, questioned the overall benefit of the low and moderate income priced housing to Eden Prairie because of the addi- tional need to handle the 168 apartments in that area. He commented that the people buying houses in the Preserve are paying good prices, P.s well as paying for tennis courts and swimming pool. He continued that he felt that the bond issue was irrelevant and should stand on its own merits, and did not want to feel a debt incurred because of potential park development. bars. Pauling asked the Commission to re-e•jaluate the need for two hockey rinks as a duplication of facilities, and asked whether the City could not put that money to other use. Garens responded that hockey is the most "dolls It expen- sive sport that can be played, and added that there are many enthusiastic " supporters in this area, and felt we should support this sport at this time because it will not get cheaper. He added further that it will also be used for free skating. Kruell asked where the duplication was. Jessen answered that Edenvale was close to other rinks, although there was none closer to Preserve than three miles. He smoke to the research done by HAEP and the dramatic increase in the curve of the number of kids playing hockey, and the fact that the City is already behind in the construction of hockey rinks. He agreed that Edenvale was closer to a skating rink complex, but the need was still there. Fifield asked whether permanent hockey boards would be installed and whether they were to be lighted. Jessen responded affirmative to both uestions, and added that these items, plus a warming house would equal about 91 MOO. Garens responded further to question of so much money being used for the hockey rinks by commenting that we have an opportunity to receive .funding to develop these rinks, although it is an excessive amount, but since he pays taxes, he feels we should take advantage of this opportunity. Mrs. Buckman, addressing Garens, said she had done much research on the guide- lines of the grant, and it was her opinion that specific purposes for the funds were not given, and felt it was the job of the Commission to decide the priori- ties. Kruell asked whether HAEP has been asked to contribute to facilities as other cormnmities do. Jessen responded that they have contributed the youth boards at Praivie View rink, have helped us move those, and have provided various services in lieu of funds. MOTION: Kruell moved that we recommend that the Council adopt the recommenda- tions of the Staff as presented in their PARKS AND RECREATIONAL FACILITIES DEVE.- LOPI-MIT .: PROJECTS FINANCING IN CONJUNCTION WITH THE CETA GRANT report of July 15, 1977, excluding nos. 12, 15, and 16. l DISCUSSIONS Jessen responded to further questions on the importance of including irrigation, and the assurance that even though the local share for this funding will come Minutes - Parks, Rec. and approved Natural Resources Commission - - Monday, July 18, 1977 C.. from the 1968 park bond fund, there will be adequate seed money ($50s000)for next year, accumulating from property and investment earnings. Garens inquired if there was availability for funding if money for the Edenvale rink was- used elsewhere this year. Jessen responded that the Council could levy tax for a facility, but asked Commissioners to consider how important it was to the recreational program of the City. Garens requested that Kruell amend his Motion to include deletion of the hockey rink at Edenvale. Kruell responded that if a specific purpose was spelled out to use money, he would accept the amendment. Jessen emphasized the need for Edenvale residents tole able to respond, and spoke to Council action and the two meetings held with residents, and their belief that a hockey rink will be included in their park. Anderson spoke to the present amount of building permits being issued, and felt any facilitiy put in now would certainly be used. Mrs. Pauling felt it was important what the City felt it needed, rather than what the Preserve and Edenvale feel they needed. She was in favor of contacting Edenvale residents on their opinion. Mr. Pauling inquired whether there were statistics to refer to, rather than just HAEP figures, to help determine the need, and referring to the 25% of our federal grants that would be spent on hockey rinks, asked the Commission to seriously consider what will benefit Eden Prairie the most. Retterath, because of repetition, called the question. VOTE: Motion died with a vote of 3-3. Kruell - "aye" Fifield - "nay" Anderson - "aye" Retterath - "nay" Garens - "aye" Upton - "nay" i MOTION: Retterath moved to recommend to the Council that the portion of the Staff report of July 15th dealing with the hockey rink at Edenvale be tabled until Edenvale is represented, and make the decision at that time. Notion died for the lack of a second. DISCUSSION: Fifield stated that his reason for voting negatively was because he questioned the need for a rink at Edenvale because of its close proximity to other hockey rinks such as Forest Hills, Prairie View and Round Lake. Upton explained that she responded negatively to the motion because whe was unsure whether they were voting on how the money would be spent, or the over all plan. Jessen, as a point of clarification, explained that the vote was whether to procede to develop site of fundings in conjunction with CETA grants. He further explained that the Commission could vote to re-consider the Edenvale �. rink, if they decided it was not needed. Minutes - Parks, Rec. and approved Natural Resources Commission - 5 - Monday, July 18, 1977 MOTION: Retterath moved that we forward to the Council, support of the CETA Grant report of July 15th, excluding items nos. 12, 15 & 16, and express reservation on need of Edenvale hockey rink until consult- ing residents of Edenvale. Garens seconded, motion carried unanimously. Kruell requested additional information that will refute or support our present stand. MOTION: Garens moved to extend invitation to Edenvale residents and HASP to present their opinions of the hockey situation in their area. Kruell requested addition of amendment of invitation extended to Preserve residents also. Garens accepted the amendment. AMENDED 1,10TION: Garens moved to 'extend invitation to Edenvale and Preserve residents, along with representatives of HASP, to present their opinions of the hockey situation in their area. Kruell seconded, motion carried unanimously. fi+ N.B. Request by Bob Gartner for Lake AuRementation Svatem e= Question tabled because of lack of appearance by Mr. Gartner. V. RECOMMENDATIONS AND REPORTS CA. Reports of Commissioners Anderson spoke to the invitation by letter received from the City of Minnetonka requesting the presence of Commissioners at a meeting to be held on July 21st, at Minnetonka High School, for the purpose of establish- ing communication with neighboring communities. r Retterath and Kruell volunteered to represent the Eden Prairie PR & NR Commission at the meeting. B. Reports of Staff 1. Eden Prairie Eauestrian Cgnter Lease e Jessen requested that the item be tabled as the Stable management people have asked to meet with the City Attorney and himself on July 19 regarding the lease. MOTION: Retterath moved to table the issue, seconded by Upton. Motion carried unanimously. 2. Summ-er Registration Recap Kruell asked for information on whether the programs were meeting the needs of our population today. Mrs. Pauling spoke to the favorable acceptance of the programs in the Preserve, especially the Munchkins age group, but expressed concern whether two leaders were adequate to menage this large a group of four year olds. r Minutes - Parks, Rec. and approved Natural Resources Commission - 6 - Monday, July 18, 1977 Y r� Upton and Garens expressed agreement with that concern and recommended more supervision at , a ratio,'- of one adult to eight or ten children + be considered for next year. .'r MOTION: Retterath moved to receive and file the Memo of July 15, 1977 received from Sandy Werts, Recreation Supervisor on the Summer Registra- tion Recap. Fifield seconded, motion carried unanimously. Jessen commented that the change discussed in increased leadership ti will be reflected in the budget .for next year. " 3. 1977-78 Park Develo- ment Program Previously considered. (See pg. 2) VI. OLD BUSINESS rt A. Park Dedication Re uirements - CASH PARK FEE E r Jessen spoke to the charge by the Council to the Commission to develop a general policy in this matter to help the Council and Commission reach an understanding as to the use of the CASH PARK FEE. f Garens expressed opposition to no, .5 of Memo provided outlining some cash park fee policies. He felt that money generated in one area should not be used in another unless on a loan basis and that park be developed before using the fee to acquire another site. Jessen responded that the basis of the cash park fee is to acquire the land for neighborhood park facilities, and added that some areas will generate much revenue and some not as much, and that some areas have paid for park facilities but have not received them.(through park bond of 1968) Kruell spoke to view of developers, and possible opposition to use of this fee in another area of the City, referring specifically to the Bluff proposal and Prairie East development. Jessen explained that the developer is aware of this, but has agreed to the idea. Jessen responded to question by Kruell on preparation of a larger scale map, which Jessen said was being developed presently on Community Parks and Trail System to be used as a guide. Garens requested delineation by specific boundaries to help identify exact location of sites and service area. k Jessen answered questions posed by Kruell on today's description of a bikeway/hi.keway, referring to the Task Force Study on that issue pre- pared recently, indicating bikeway/hikeway requirements and recommenda- tions. Garens re-stated his concern with no. 5 of the report, and spoke to the people wanting to use their facilities once acquired. I Minutes - Parkes, Rea. and :approved Natural Resources Commission - 7 - Idonday, July 18, 1977 C Kruell felt development should come after all sides were acquired, because if the City began spot acquisition, we would run into pro- blems with any potential bond issue. Retterath felt it would be a form of a loan, and would eventually be paid back to the area, and felt this was acceptable. Jessen explained that we are talking only of acquistion of land, which is approximately $2502000 per site, and that the fee would have to be doubled in order to develop these sites. He spoke to a different fee for every area in town, if we develop land after acquistion, and asked to what level will the sites be developed? Kruell suggested the possibility of future grants to help in the develop- ment of these sites, and Anderson spoke to possible funds from the municipal liquor store profits. NATION: Garens moved to recommend to the Council, CASH PARK I`EE POLICIES as outlined in the Memo of July 15, 1977 from Jessen, with following additions: "with monies in excess of above" added to nos. 5.b. & 5.d. Upton seconded, motion carried unanimously. B. Commission Goats Jessen spoke to the Goals listed on Draft 2, report of July 18, 1977, containing suggestions by Commissioners. Upton questioned the status of the slope ordinance. Jessen responded that the City Attorney is developing the opinion and will be submitted at a future date. Anderson questioned completion of the water quality study at Bryant Lake Park. Jessen said it was complete and they are awaiting the final report. " Kruell suggested the combination of nos. 1 and 6, and questioned no. 2, to what extent would the Public Relations program be carried. Jessen s' answered that they are working on it, and it will be submitted at budget time. Kruell commented that he was not in favor of a large scale program at this time, considering where we. are presently in the process of developing our goals. MOTION: Retterath mo red to accomplish Commission Goals, as outlined in Draft 2 of July 15, 1977; combining nos. 1 & 6; and keeping in mind that ' no. 2 (public relations program) will be "low key". Garen seconded. DISCUSSION: The suggestion of the consideration of reorganization into two separate Commissions for parks and recreation was discussed. Jessen commented that it was contrary to the trend that these two work together and often ( overlap. Minutes -- Parks, Rea. and tapproved Natural Resources - 8 - Monday, July 18, 1977 l Garens felt the Commission should consider this in order to be prepared for this discussion when Comprehensive Guide Plan is completed, since this was one of the suggestions made by Mr. Brauer. Anderson requested a amendment to the Motion to delete no. 5. Retterath refused the amendment, because he wanted further discussion on no. 5. Kruell felt that a wide diversity of opinion was presently represented on the Commission, and added that for the size of our community, the present format is the most acceptable. Anderson spoke to the change in trend of recreation and to the variances in preference in recreation. Garens requested withdrawal of his second, unless amendment to delete no. 5 was accepted as part of the Motion. I' Retterath withdrew his Motion. MOTIONS Garens moved to accept the following amendments to the Commission Goals of Draft 2, July 15, 19775 Nos. 1 & 6 be combined; deletion of no. 5; no. 7 becoming no. 5; addition of no. 6 - status of slope ordinance; and addition of no. 7 - status of water quality study. Upton seconded, motion carried with a vote of 5-1, Retterath casting the dissenting vote. VII. NEW BUSINESS A. Discussion of Potential Impact of Year-Round School on City Recreation Program^ Anderson spoke to the need to meet the change in needs of students on a fifteen day block, and felt the Commission should start consider- ing the impact of year-round school. MOTIONS Garens moved to direct the Staff to undertake a preliminary 3 study on the problems and opportunities of "year-round" school on the recreation program of the City. Retterath seconded, motion carried unanimously. B. Riley Creek - Land for Sale Jessen spoke to recent tour of part of the creek by the Commissioners. 6 It was concensus of the Commissioners that the area toured be looked at as part of the total "package" of the Riley Creek corridor. k MOTION: Kruell moved to consider the Riley Creek area, in conjunction with all of the proposed recreation space from land originating at Lake Riley through to the Minnesota River, through Purgatory Creek area, Cedar Hills, and any other major acquisition which the City may be con- templating in the creek corridor south of Co. Rd. 1. Retterath seconded, motion carried unanimously. Minutes - Parks, Rec. and approved Natural Resources Commission - 9 - Monday, July 18, 1977 C. Staffing of Preserve Pooh - Retterath NIDTION: Garens moved to table this issue until future meeting. Kruell seconded, motion carried unanimously. D. Dutch Elm Control Responsibility - Kruell Kruell spoke to the delay in collection and removal of elms and asked what the status was. Jessen responded that the entire community was surveyed, including public lands, and they are using all possible help for tree removal. He spoke to the.absence of tools to enforce the Ordinance and enticement of the subsidy last year, and to the loss of 8,000 to 9,000 trees this year. He said the best we can hope for is- . to clean up this winter, and with that we should have reasonable success next-year.- _ Mrs. Pauling asked whether the disease is inert when trees are chipped, referring to the chips available at Anderson Lake from dead elms. ; Jessen explained that all of the experts ffeel`it is safe to use the chips for other purposes, without fear of spreading the potential for breeding ground for the beetles. Mr. Pauling questioned the tabling of Item C. Garens replied that it was their feeling it should not be discussed until more facts are C.. present. He added that lifeguards are adequate at City parks at this time and does not know whether lifeguard staffing at the Preserve is pertinent at this time. E. Park Plapning - Kruell fi Kruell spoke to coverage of the subject in previous discussions of the evening. F. Mitchell Lake - Kruell Questioned.ptmits being given out to remove water from the lakes for irrigation purposes, and requested a review of water withdrawal policy for upcoming Agenda. VIII. ADJOURNMErrT!' MOTION: Upton moved to adjourn at IOS35 PM, seconded by Fifield. Motion carried unanimously. Respectfully submitted, Donna Stanley Recording Secretary