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Parks and Recreation - 02/03/1997 a 1997 1 i FEBRUARY 3 ,s MINUTES v Parks, recreation & Natural y Resources Commission i CITY OF EDEN PRAIRIE I APPROVED MINUTES EDEN PRAIRIE PARKS,RECREATION AND NATURAL RESOURCES MONDAY,FEBRUARY 3, 1997 7:00 P.M.CITY CENTER Council Chambers 8080 Mitchell Road COMMISSION MEMBERS PRESENT: Claire Hilgeman, Chair. Bruce Bowman, Richard Brown,Don Jacobson,Vicki Koenig, John Wilson COMMISSION MEMBERS ABSENT: Bruce Bowman COMMISSION STAFF: Robert A. Lambert, Director of Parks, Recreation and Facilities, Stuart A. Fox, Manager of Parks and Natural Resources. Elinda Bahley,Recording Secretary j S STUDENT REPRESENTATIVES: Jennifer Frccmycr,Melody Hasse 1. ROLL CALL 3 The meeting was called to order at 7:00 p.m.by Chair Hilgeman. Commissioner i Wilson arrived at 7:05 p.m.and was excused at 9:15 p.m. t if. APPROVAL OF AGENDA 3 a a MOTION: Koenig moved, seconded by Brown, to approve the agenda as published. Motion carried 5-0. t 111. APPROVAL OF MINUTES f A. JANUARY 6. 1997 Kocnig indicated there was confusion between the Eden Prairie Baseball Association and the Eden Prairie Baseball Club and asked staff to make the appropriate changes in the minutes. Koenig noted on page 4,at the end of the first sentence,add...and splinter groups. Koenig noted on page 7,the first sentence,More is spelled incorrectly. f .�I t Approved Minutes Parks,Recreation and Natural Resources Monday, February 3,1997 1-lilgeman noted on page 5, the second paragraph should read... Hilgeman noted that the meeting on December I I was an attempt to see if the two groups could work and stay together. 1 MOTION: Koenig moved,seconded by Jacobson,to approve the minutes of the Jan::ery 6, 1997 Eden Prairie Parks.Recreation and Natural Resources Commission mccting as amended. Motion carried 4-0-1 with one abstention by Kracum. j Q. JANUARI'7� 1997 i r Koenig noted on page 2, seventh paragraph, the second sentence should read... Koenig was concerned that we have some facilities that arc open to i use for reunions,corporations,ctc. i MOTION: Koenig moved,seconded by Jacobson,to approve the minutes of the January 7, 1997 Joint City Council/Parks, Recreation and Natural j Resources Commission mccting as amended. Motion carried 4-0-1 with one abstention by Kracum. I C. JANUAI2Y li 1997 i i MOTION: Brown moved,seconded by Koenig,to approve the minutes of j the January 13, 1997 Eden Prairie Parks,Recreation and Natural Resources Commission meeting as published. Motion carried 4-0-1 with one abstention by Kracum. (Commissioner Wilson arrived at 7:05 p.m.) I i 1V• PG,fIT10NS.REO I •.ITS AND COMMUNI ATIONS ,, A. Dlcc +ci�n with Athletic A cocintions Res Polio and Standards for Use f of Public Faciliti", i Staff referred the Commission to a memo dated January 14, 1997, from Robert A.Lambert,Director of Parks.Recreation and Facilities.and a letter dated January 27, 1997, from Mark Davis, President of the Eden Prairie Foxjcts. l 2 I I Approved Minutes Parks,Recreation and Natural Resources Monday, February 3, 1997 Lambert explained that at the special meeting on January 13,in which staff met with representatives from many of the athletic associations, they reviewed a proposed policy for use of public facilities. At that meeting there were some recommendations for a number of changes to the policy. The meeting took about three hours and they never did get to the discussion of setting up standards. He asked everyone to send him a list of how their association operates in temts of primary season,age breakdown,and how many uses per week their teams need. Lambert reviewed and discussed changes made to the revised policy for guidelines and priority use. On page 4 under standards for use of public facilities,staff recommended changing the primary season dates for baseball and softball Iields to May I to July 30. Soccer fields would also be May I to July 30 and volleyball courts would be September 10 to November 15. It was also suggested by staff today that they have a facility added called, outdoor rinks, and the primary season would run from December 15 to February 15. The only standard staff recommended is that there be one open hockey rink every night in the community that the public can use on a first come first serve basis. That open rink would rotate from park to park. Lambert said a lot of time was spent at the special meeting defining Priority Ill teams and he explained what it means. He said these arc not staff rules. These lire rules they are trying to develop from input of the users,and present them to the Parks Commission who represent the residents of the community. The Parks Commission will then make a recommendation to the City Council. The City Council will make the final decision on these policies and guidelines. The language under flees was changed for the second season. Rather than trying to anticipate what the fee might be,the proposed policy states a fee for second season will be charged based on what the costs are going to be to the - City. The organization should come in and explain how many fields they want and what kind of service they want above and beyond mowing the grass for second season. The City will tell them the cost for these services and they will decide whether they are willing to pay it. That should meet the City's needs and address the concerns the City Council has on non budgeted escalating costs that the City has no control over. Lambert explained the administrative procedures included in the guidelines, Discussion continued concerning the age breakdowns and uses per week that f 3 1 r I I Approved Minutes Parks, Recreation and Natural Resources Monday, February 3, 1997 are needed for each organization. The City defines uses per week as the number of times teams play each week. John Krohn,president of the Eden Prairie Soccer Club,noted under uses per week for travel teams the category should be"I 1 and over" for the soccer team. Mark Davis,president of the Eden Prairie Foxjcts Swim Club,commented that the policy suggested under Priority I I I does not really meet the needs of the Foxjets Swim Club. They are burdened by several things that requires than to keep their size up. Each year they pay roughly$20,000 it year for pool fees which is about$80.00 per swimmer per year. Another thing that's different between them and other youth organizations is that swimming requires a professional staff. It's a very expensive sport to run with professional coaches. They depend on a club that has not only Eden Prairie swimmers but swimmers from other communities that surround Eden Prairie to help pay those fees. They do not meet the 95 percent criteria outlined. He referred to his letter of January 27 and asked the Commission to adopt a ' provision in the policy that would grant Priority III status for swimming teams based on the total number of Eden Prairie residents served. It would not serve the community if a 10 member team,all Eden Prairie members, were given priority over a team that has 165 Eden Prairie swimmers like the Foxjets. f Brown asked what the Foxjets expects their growth to be with respect to residents versus non residents. Davis replied they are always going to have many more Eden Prairie kids because of the convenience. It takes quite a commitment from a family to drive an extended distance to have their child go to a swimming practice which could be up to five times a week. They really rely on the non resident swimmers to help pay for their fees. Hilgeman noted they are really asking for a variance for the Foxjcts and Davis agreed. A. Koenig suggested a nominal fee for non resident swimmers set by the City Council. Davis noted the non resident swimmers are already paying$80.00 to $100.00 in pool fees which is a fairly significant amount. Koenig said they would probably be paying that somewhere else also. Davis noted the Foxjcts pay the highest swimming Pecs in the entire State of Minnesota on an hourly basis and would not be opposed to nominal fees for their non resident swimmers. ` { 1 4 a� I t Approved Minutes Parks,Recreation and Natural Resources Monday,February 3,1997 Marcy Wiesner, 13022 Cardinal Creek Road,commented she has been in Eden Prairie for I I years and her children have participated in numerous programs in Eden Prairie. She indicated she was here on behalf of the j satellite program, DAT Swim Club, and was a previous member of the Foxjcts. The coaches of the satellite program have inquired about getting ' some unavailable nool time in Eden Prairie. The Foxjcts program was in existence in the Fall with about 223 swimmers utilizing space. The DAT Swim Club was blocked in their attempt for pool time because then the Foxjcts took that pool time they had not utilized in the Fall once they learned who was taking the Fall time. There are only about 15 swimmers and arc not looking to take anything away from the Foxjcts. They arc asking for available pool time and a chance to get another group of kids, that had different ideas and different needs than what the Foxjcts could provide, a j chance to work out at some of the pools. They have been accused of recruiting kids unethically which is not true. She also noted that even though the Foxjcts have approximately 250 kids,all those kids are not in the water everyday. Wilson asked how much pool time does her organization need. Wiesner replied what they were told was available at the time was 3:30 to 5:00,and it was available Monday, Tuesday, Thursday,and perhaps Friday. They were then told the Foxjcts wanted that time due to priority usage. They I asked if the Foxjcts would be willing to share it and give them two or three lanes. The Foxjcts said they intended to use all the lanes every evening to serve their needs. ; i Ililgeman was concerned about one group monopolizing the pool and freezing out other groups. Lambert replied they have never set standards to J the Foxjcts. The City encourages these groups to buy as much time as possible in the pool to reduce the subsidy for use of that building. This is the I N first time there has ever been another group requesting time. J Brown asked what exactly are her organization's needs. Wiesner replied ideally they would like to have a pool in Eden Prairie everyday for two hours. They did not request that originally because they knew the Foxjcts and the City programs utilize most of the time. They were willing to take whatever was available. She noted that the figure skating club and the hockey club are sharing a rink and have worked out a nice system. She was hoping for that with swimming. � I 5 i Approved Minutes Parks,Recreation and Natural Resources Monday,February 3, 1997 Hilgeman commented this is an issue that can not be decided tonight and is something the Commission has to address. Koenig asked where open swim fits into this problem. Lambert replied Priority 1 are City programs and open swim is a City program. Lambert said he would meet with both the swim clubs to sec what their requests arc. lie wants than both to sec what everybody is asking for. He will then give the Commission some options at the next meeting. I Davis commented that the Foxjets do not solicit for non resident swimmers. They come to their club for their reputation. However, they do solicit heavily through the Eden Prairie elementary schools. They have supported the community and the community has supported them,and they hope the City will continue to support their desire to grow their swim club and continue to do well. He noted that the DAT Swim Club is an Apple Valley based organization, not an Eden Prairie based organization. They are governed by the bylaws of a swim team that is based in Apple Valley. He hopes that the City does not provide priority status to a club that is not based in Eden Prairie. q� A resident commented that he does not want to sec Eden Prairie clubs loose q their priority to another club. He wants to sec the Commission stay focused on Eden Prairie. Hilgeman replied the Commission shares the same views with him. 'S Ken Bombcn, 9260 Talus Circle, president of the Eden Prairie Soccer ! Association,was concerned about the start date for soccer being changed because they have always been under the assumption they were allowed practices prior to the first game. Lambert replied they don't want an scheduled practices or games before May 1 because they need the time to get the fields ready. Bombcn said he has a problem with that because their J current start date is April 28 and that information has been public to their members for about a month already. Lambert said they can start April 28 for this Year: however, in the future athletic associations should plan on a May I Stan date. Bombcn was concerned about the City's treatment of two separate seasons in dif Brent manners, His association has had two seasons longer than anyone. They would be hard pressed to determine which would be their primary 6 f x i Approved Minutes Parks, Recreation and Natural Resources Monday,February 3, 1997 season. Their greater numbers actually occur in the Fall. Hilgeman asked if there was any problem with the soccer association changing their primary season to the Fall. Lambert replied it would be a problem and explained why. Bomben said they don't have a problem paying for the striping and mowing in both seasons. There arc a lot of little reasons why they would be strongly inclined to push for a primary Fall season including convenience. The primary season in other cities is the Fall for soccer. Lambert explained the City needs to give those fields a rest so second seasons may only have one field available. The fields need to be prepared for the primary season. John Riggs,8400 Red Rock Road,noted he has lived in Eden Prairie for five years and explained his experience with different athletic associations. He was concerned that the Foxjcts are not sharing pool time with other clubs. Other communities arc willing to share time with the Foxjcts but the Foxjcts are not willing to share with another Eden Prairie club. He also noted that ' Mark Davis,the president of the Foxjcts,did not give his address because he does not live in Eden Prairie. s Dan Desaulniers, 17849 Liv Lane,explained that the football club takes in a lot of Chtuihassen boys because they don't have a football program. He was concerned that the football club does not fall under Priority III and suggested asking Chanhassen it'Eden Prairie could use one of their facilities 1 as a practice field or a game site. Lambert replied the City would be very f receptive to looking at that as it typical variance. If Chanhassen is providing their share of facilities,and it works out,then it would fall within the Priority III- DCSathlier5 commented they have to keep fields open for rain out games and believes the uses for basketball were too high. i Scott Olson, 16803 Manor Road, director of the Basketball Association, commented that the numbers per week listed are the times of utilization they would like to have per week. He was concerned they were not getting the t usage at the travel level or in house level and it's because of the facilities. lie also noted they share the court during practice games and it's very crowded. The games go from 6:00 p.m.until close to 10:00 p.m.,which is late for 1111h graders,and the parents don't like that. He was also concerned about a child of divorced parents counting as a resident if only one of the parents lived in Eden Prairie. t 7 I .�I i Approved Minutes Parks,Recreation and Natural Resources Monday, February 3, 1997 Wilson asked what time they use the facilities on weekends. Olson replied games start at 9:00 a.m.and go until 5:30 or 6:00 p.m. for games. Practices are usually from 6:00 p.m. until 9:30 and there are no weekend practices. They just play games on the weekends. Thcrc are no gyms open on the I weekends for practice because their all full from games. They have about 1 150 members and it's been a steady climb. Flilgeman asked if the amount of uses arc to be taken as promises of what the City will provide if they ask for it. Lambert replied no, that these arc maximum guidelines. If facilities arc available they will try to accommodate up to the maximum. John Walstrom,representing the wrestling team,commented his organization has grown to 300 young men ranging from kindergarten through eighth a grade. They arc at a point where they have asked the community to ask basketball to move over a little bit to give them a space for wrestling. It's a dangerous situation with so many people. Primarily the season for wrestling is November I through March 30. Practices arc three times a week 1 regardless of age,meets are usually on Saturday,and there is only in house I wrestling. 'There arc no"travel teams,"although all wresters participate in i meets against other communities. i Drew Bartley,9217 Hiawatha Circle,representing the Eden Prairie Baseball Association,asked for a clarification on how it variance is granted if a group comes before the Commission asking f'or one. Flilgeman explained that variances usually start with Bob and he puts them on the agenda. The Commission reviews the variance, makes a recommendation to the City Council,and the City Council takes action on it. i Koenig asked that the swimming club be included in their policy of non residents paying an additional fee. . e Jacobson asked what staff plans to do with item six on page two regarding head coaches being trained or certified. Lambert said they're going to have to make a further definition of what trained is. tic wants to hear what they are giving their coaches on safety,values,and liability.The City will not be policing it and it will be on the organization's word of honor that they tire certified. Staff' feels [it least the head couch should be certified. Fle requested each athletic association provide written documentation of how their coaches arc trained. i 8 Approved Minutes Parks,Recreation and Natural Resources Monday,February 3, 1997 Lambert reviewed the changes made to the policy noting that the wrestling team will be added to the chart with four uses per week from November 1 through March 30, all in house, and the addition of outdoor rinks from December 15 to February 15. The only thing not decided yet is what the primary season is going to be for soccer. lie reminded everyone that these standards are for maximum uses per week based on the availability of facilities. MOTION 1: Wilson moved, seconded by Jacobson, to accept staffs recommendations as amended for priority use of public facilities. Motion carried 6-0. MOTION 2: Brown moved, seconded by Wilson, to postpone the swimming requests until they have met with staff and staff can present both positions from the different groups for the Commission's consideration at the 3 March 3 meeting. Motion carried 6-0. i V. DEVELOPMENT PROPOSALS VI. OLD BUSINESS Lone, V11. NEW BUSINESS i A. Appointment to the Housing.Transportation and Social Services Board 1 I Staff referred the Commission to a memo dated January 21, 1997, from David Lindahl,HRA Manager. } MOTION: Brown moved,seconded by Wilson,to appoint Vicki Koenig as the Parks Commission representative for the Housing,Transportation,and I Social Services Board. Motion carried 6-0. B. 121:c0nuuendatlou t 'nncel'1'rn iillounl 4th �f lulu Cclebratlon Staff referred the Commission to a memo dated January 28. 1997, from 9 I Approved Minutes Parks,Recreation and Natural Resources Monday,February 3,1997 Laurie Helling,Manager of Recreation Services,and Tria Mann,Recreation Supervisor. Lambert commented that the police department has strongly supported this recommendation if there is not enough parking. It will cause major problems in the community if there is not adequate parking, Tria Mann,Recreation Supervisor,commented last year one of the parking lots at the school was under construction and the whole front of the school was under construction so they could not use that sidewalk. The police worked very hard on making sure the pedestrian flow of traffic was safe and they had a hard time dealing with that. It is even more of a concern this year. Koenig agreed that no matter how organized they try to be about asking people to double up,this would be a big problem if it's not cancelled. Lambert explained this is one more year where they can't use any of the soccer fields or baseball fields at the high school. This summer County Road ; ` 4 is going to be two lanes in front of the new high school access road. 7 Mann said the earlier they work on this problem the earlier they can publicize it to the residents. She reviewed the community leisure opportunities that could be provided as an alternative to the traditional 4th of 1 July Celebration. r Wilson asked if everything up at Round Lake would be terminated. Mann said the only thing that will be open at Round Lake will be the beaches and picnic areas. Lambert said they expect Round Lake to be full from people swimming and picnicking. Staff recommended holding a concert at Staring Lake Park tiom 6:00 to 9:00 and have concessions there Koenig was concerned about the cost of the laser light show. Mann explained what it laser light show is noting that it's less expensive than fireworks. Brown was concerned about Norwest receiving recognition for their donation. Mann said Norwcst has agreed to contribute $7.000 towards fireworks for this year. Their sponsorship has already been acknowledged in the calendar. II'there are no fireworks,there will be no donation. 10 I {" Approved Minutes Parks,Recreation and Natural Resources Monday, February 3, 1997 Koenig asked if they are planning on making it a free shuttle to the Taste of Minnesota. Mann replied they need to sit down with Southwest Metro to sec what they can provide before deciding whether it would be a free service to the public or a cost. 1 (Commissioner Wilson was excused at 9:15 p.m.) 3 J Fox explained the construction that will take place at the high school noting it will take place between June 16 and September I. In addition, the exclusionary fence is going to remain around the perimeter to make sure they have a controlled access off Eden Prairie Road. i MOTION: Brown moved, seconded by Koenig, to accept staffs recommendation to cancel the 4th of July Celebration and the money to go towards requests for funds to be reallocated to help provide the other leisure activities and the July park and recreation events. Motion carried 5-0. f C. Request Authorization for Cancellation of Opt n Skating for 1997 Spring tand Summer Tournaments ' Staff referred the Commission to a memo dated Januar y 22, 1997,from Joel i Klute,lee Arcna and Concession Coordinator. j Klute explained the Eden Prairie Community Center has received numerous requests to hold hockey tournaments ranging from one to three day events. Team Minnesota and Super Series are annual tournaments held at the Community Center. These tournaments as well as new inquirers have requested hours which would result in the cancellation of open skate on several occasions. He reviewed the dates of the open skate cancellation requests from the various tournaments. s I lilgeman was concerned about cancellation of open skate 31 times. Mute explained there will be 62 additional open skate times added during the summer to make up for the 31 dates. Klute gave an update on the Room D situation regarding the Hockey Association. MOTION: Koenig moved, seconded by Kracum, to accept staffs recommendation for cancellation of open skate for the 1997 Spring and ' 11 i I Approved Minutes Parks,Recreation and Natural Resources Monday,February 3, 1997 Summer tournaments per the memo dated January 22, 1997. Motion carried 5-0. Vill. REPORTS OF COMMISSIONERS AND STAFF A. Rcnort of Director of Park. Recrenti nand Fuclrrte� 1. Land Use Breakdown R yuort This was an FYI item. 3 2. Meeting of Conservation Alliance of Fden Prairie February 11. 1997,7:00 p.m. This was an FYI item. 3. Summary of Recommendations for the Parks RtgreAlignaad Natural Reson ces Department for the Senior Issue Task Fore Report of November 1996 This was an FYI item. 4. Article on "The Challennes for Newly Elected Orn This was an FYI item. 5. Commission Attendance Reporl for 1996 This was an FYI item. 6. Letter from DouL McDo.aal a This was an FYI item. ' IX ADJOURNMENT MOTION: Brown moved,seconded by Jacobson,to adjourn the meeting. Motion carried 5-0. The meeting adjourned at 9:35 p.m. 12