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Heritage Preservation - 08/21/2000 APPROVED MINUTES EDEN PRAIRIE HERITAGE PRESERVATION COMMISSION Monday,August 21, 2000 7:00 p.m. City Center Prairie Rooms A and B Commission Members: Jan Mosman, Chairperson; Deborah Barkley,Jennie Brown, Lori Peterson- Benike, Kati Simons,Art Weeks, Mike Wroblewski Commission Staff: John Gertz, Historic Preservation Specialist; Peggy Rasmussen, Recording Secretary I. ROLL CALL Chair Mosman called the meeting to order at 7:03 p.m. Commissioner Wroblewski arrived shortly after. II. APPROVAL OF AGENDA Mosman added two items under Old Business. One was an update on the Birch Island Woods, and the other was an update on the Gym Task Force. MOTION: Peterson-Benike moved, seconded by Brown, to approve the agenda as published and amended. Motion carried 7-0. III. APPROVAL OF MINUTES —JULY 10, 2000 MOTION: Peterson-Benike moved, seconded by Simons, to approve the minutes of the July 10, 2000 Heritage Preservation Commission meeting as published. Motion carried 5-0, with Commissioners Barkley and Weeks abstaining, due to their absence from the meeting. IV. REPORTS AND REQUESTS Kathie Case, Vice-President of the Eden Prairie Historical Society, gave a report to the Commission on the Historical Society. Members have been doing oral history interviews. These are available to read or check out of the museum, located in the City Center. If any of the HPC members know of a Girl Scout or Boy Scout troop that would like to see the museum, Case said to let her know and she will open the museum for them. Also, the person who has been storing the old water tower has to vacate his property because of the expansion of Flying Cloud Airport. If the water tower is in good condition, the City will be moving it to Miller Park. With regard to the Smith-Douglas-More House, Case said she wanted to make it clear that the Historical Society would like to see part of it being used as a museum, in addition to another use such as a coffee shop, antique store or tea room. The Society never HERITAGE PRESERVATION COMMISSION MINUTES August 21, 2000 Page 2 wanted the house to just sit there empty and unused, but definitely doesn't want it to be sold. Case said she called Michael Koop, with the State Historic Preservation Office, who said he was disappointed in the idea of the house being sold. He suggested designating the interior of the house as a Heritage Preservation Site, in addition to the exterior. This would help protect it if it is sold. Such a designation would have to go through a hearing process. The house should also be eligible for the National Register of Historic Places. Case said that twenty years ago the Council at that time bought the More House. Now this Council is willing to sell it. In 20 years there will be a different HPC and if that HPC doesn't care as much as this one, it could be torn down. Many properties have been designated but these three the Historical Society thought would always be saved. It is hard to think of selling the house or losing the interior. Case ended by saying this house is worth fighting for. V. REPORTS OF COMMISSION AND STAFF VI. OLD BUSINESS A. Adaptive Reuse Proposal Mosman suggested the Commissioners make a motion to override the HPC's previous motion, made at the June 19, 2000, meeting, which included the option of selling the Smith-Douglas-More House. The Commission much prefers the leasing option. There was a lot of pressure from Staff to include selling as an option, because if HPC had said they wanted to save and use all three properties the Adaptive Reuse Proposal might not have been approved by the City Council. Council probably would have said it would cost too much to rehabilitate all three properties. Weeks disagreed that a new motion was necessary. He watched the last two Council meetings, and it seemed to him that not enough attention was being paid to the process that would be followed before a decision is made on leasing or selling. He looks at the Adaptive Reuse Proposal as the beginning of the process. In order to be open about this, Council has to look at both options. The RFP has been sent out, which is the next step. The process needs to be clarified in terms of the HPC's role in what is going to happen to the house. The real estate consultant should give HPC feedback. The consultant is charged with looking at both the leasing of the house and the second option of selling it, then coming back and making recommendations on the viability of these options. There should be a dialog between the HPC and the consultant before the HPC says what is best for the house. Gertz said he thought the Council was fairly clear in stating the leasing option was the priority option and would be explored first. He believed they would explore leasing and then look at selling. Both Councilmembers Case and Tyra-Lukens supported leasing. HERITAGE PRESERVATION COMMISSION MINUTES August 21, 2000 Page 3 Mosman said she read a report to the City Council and explained what the HPC was trying to get across in its minutes. Mosman read the first paragraph of her report on the Smith-Douglas-More House. "Regarding the topic of historic houses from the July 18 Council meeting, I felt the need to clarify the HPC's intent on the Smith-Douglas-More Homestead. If the HPC was recommending its highest and best use for the three houses, it would have kept all, fixed-up and maintained all, used all. There wasn't a lack of interest, a lack of potential uses, a problem of feasibility, a problem of structural integrity. There was really only the pressure of finances all around. They came down to the responsible level of recommending lease of the More house, but the HPC never intended sale to be even a thought until the leasing option is completely considered." Weeks asked what the RFP says about what responders are to do. Gertz explained the Request for Professional Services went to real estate agencies. Responses were due back August 18, 2000. The RFP asked real estate agents to look at the house and they were sent a copy of the Adaptive Reuse Proposal. Within those limits they were asked to provide a marketing analysis of the property for a commercial use, both as a lease option and sale option. Then the City Council would move forward based on the information provided. The Request for Professional Services put more emphasis on the leasing option as a priority, so that makes it clear the City is most interested in the leasing option. The information in the Adaptive Reuse Proposal on the sale option provides an important piece of information the Council needs to have. If the HPC hadn't provided it, the Council would ask for it anyway, because it would be making a decision without all the options available. Wroblewski said he believes there was a misunderstanding by the Council. The HPC is clearly behind Option 1, whereas the Council may believe the HPC is split 50-50 between Options 1 and 2. Gertz said he didn't believe the Council was of that opinion. Councilmembers should understand the Commission is very much in favor of the leasing option. Weeks said there should be no misunderstanding by the Council if they read the report, which is very clear. Peterson-Benike said if the Commission assumes that is not clear to the Council, the Commissioners should make a new motion to clarify the HPC's stand. Brown asked if this motion would be conveyed to the City Council. Mosman said it would be conveyed through the minutes, which the Councilmembers receive. They will pay more attention if it in the form of a motion rather than just a discussion. Simons said although both options have been listed, HPC's priority is to lease the house. Gertz pointed out that he asked the Commissioners at several meetings for their recommendations for the Smith House. The recommendation he made was to either lease or sell, and the Commission adopted those options. Gertz said the HERITAGE PRESERVATION COMMISSION MINUTES August 21, 2000 Page 4 Commissioners would have to rescind their original motion if they want to change what it says. Mosman said the HPC wanted to make sure the Council understands selling the house is not its first recommendation, and not just let that happen without making the position of the HPC clear. The minutes of the June 2000 meeting were reviewed and the motion pertaining to the Smith House was read. Mosman said this was also read at the last Council meeting. Brown said the way the motion is written it doesn't give any weight to either Option 1 or Option 2. She read from the City's brochure stating the "Heritage Preservation Commission is established for the purpose of safeguarding the heritage of the City by preserving sites and structures which reflect significant elements of the City's cultural, social, economic, political, visual, or architectural history." She said it appears this body has been set up to preserve historic structures, so to say selling is an option appears to conflict with the purpose of the HPC. Gertz said that property is already a locally designated preservation site so the City has preserved it by ordinance. Selling it doesn't spoil the heritage preservation status of the property. It could become a residence and the public wouldn't have access, but that doesn't mean the home has not been preserved. Mosman said the owner could gut the interior,however. Weeks pointed out that the HPC could recommend use of restrictive covenants to protect the interior of the house. That's part of the process. He viewed this as an open process. If the City is getting a market analysis, it is prudent to explore both options, with the consultants recognizing the City's preference for the leasing option. MOTION: Peterson-Benike moved, seconded by Simons, that at this time the Heritage Preservation Commission believes it is important to clarify its position that it very strongly supports the leasing of the Smith-Douglas-More property and considers sale of the property as a last resort. It was never the HPC's intent to have Options 1 and 2 carry equal weight. Motion carried 6-1, with Commissioner Weeks voting nay. Wroblewski asked if there is some way to ensure the HPC meets with the consultant before a decision is made by the Council. Weeks said the HPC wants to be involved to guide the process so as much of the property can be maintained and preserved as possible, whether it's leased or sold. He thought the Commission should take a strong stand, be assertive, and identify what it believes the process is. Brown asked Weeks to explain what he thought the Commission should do. Weeks replied the HPC has certain limitations, as a group. The HPC has to itemize what its limitations are, then identify how to engage with the City Staff and the outside consultant to preserve as much of that property as possible. There HERITAGE PRESERVATION COMMISSION MINUTES August 21, 2000 Page 5 could be uses for the property that would restrict access to it, such as a group of lawyers leasing it. However, there may be some trade-offs. Simons asked what role the HPC plays in the process. Gertz replied the process is well defined in the City Code. That is to guide the historic preservation process as it relates to historic property. This Commission will be automatically involved in the review process, so any recommendations Council makes would be reviewed and commented on by the Commission and sent back to the Council. Council will review the comments and make a decision unless information is lacking. The HPC has review responsibility for all designated sites. Weeks said he doesn't think the Commission can address financial issues but can identify preservation issues and, ultimately, the Council has to make the decision. If the leasing arrangement is to work, it has to be pretty attractive for the tenant and some concessions may have to be made, but it comes down to what the HPC as a group is willing to accept. Mosman said Michael Koop suggested amending the designation to include the interior, and he sent several examples of where this has been done. There are also other things that can be done to protect the interior, but she suggesting leaving that discussion for the next meeting. Gertz said if the interior is designated, the City's Historical Preservation Code would have to be amended by the City Council, because the Code includes the exterior only. That wouldn't happen quickly because it would have to be discussed with the City's attorney. Then the Historical Preservation designation would have to be changed also. Weeks pointed out if the interior is designated, that limits who would lease the house. It almost guarantees there would be so many restrictions to a potential user that HPC's preferred Option 1 wouldn't even be possible. He recommended waiting for a while before acting on that. Gertz agreed with Weeks. If the house was going to be a museum house, restoration of the interior then becomes an important factor, but that wasn't what the HPC and Council adopted. Preservation and reuse were adopted. Commissioners were asked to call other communities, find out if they have a historical society, how many historic properties they own and how they use them, if they lease any of them or have sold any. Gertz said he would check with Maplewood, which has just moved a huge brick house and outbuildings off their foundations in order to move them off the property. B. CLG Grant Projects Gertz said the signs are at the point of completion, with the last two signs up to the final draft stage. He applied for and got an extension of the time. HERITAGE PRESERVATION COMMISSION MINUTES August 21, 2000 Page 6 Regarding the Minnesota Valley Wayside overlook, nothing has happened there, so it will probably be October before he prepares the Request for Proposals. The re-roofing of buildings at the Glen Lake Children's Camp will probably start in September. Gertz thought the City should apply for grant funds again for the camp or for the overlook. He said he would put together time lines and the amount of money available and will discuss this at the next meeting. Mosman said the camp is being used a great deal. It is rented quite often for retreats. They have dormitory-style facilities that can sleep 50 people. C. Apple Trees for Cummins House Mosman read the section of her report covering this subject. "The HPC had been offered old apple trees one-and-a-half years ago by Arlene Marshall. The HPC immediately accepted these for the Cummins-Grill property. The old variety issue didn't come up until much later. Current information on this is: Lee Johnson of US Homes Corporation has saved 100 trees. He is planning right now to try to have 50 near the Pioneer Trail edge of this development and move 50 more to the conservation zone on the south end. Securing a tree spade is a problem he is grappling with, which has not been solved yet. John Gertz has dug through diaries and found some of the old varieties that could be used at the Cummins-Grill House for a small orchard. The apples would need to be sprayed and could be used for education and actually making pies for demonstration." Mosman said that each year John Gertz does a wrap-up of all that has gone on with regard to historical preservation in Eden Prairie, and sends this to the State Historical Preservation Office. It does not go to the City Council. Mosman said she would like to make this report to the City Council in December. The Council said they liked hearing what is going on. D. Grace Church Project Archaeolou Report Commissioners received a copy of the final report. Gertz said nothing of historical significance was found underground. E. Update on Birch Island Woods Mosman said the City supports the Birch Island Woods proposal and the Historical Society has also come out in support of preserving it. She suggested the HPC also express support. The main focus of the Friends of Birch Island Woods now is putting lobbying-type pressure on Hennepin County to give the property to the City. The County wants $1.2 million for it. Mosman said there are more Indian mounds in the area than they originally thought there were. HERITAGE PRESERVATION COMMISSION MINUTES August 21, 2000 Page 7 Brown asked if the City would use HPC's recommendation to help pressure the County. Mosman said yes. MOTION: Barkley moved, seconded by Wroblewski, to support the Birch Island Woods project. Motion carried 7-0. F. Gym Task Force Mosman reported that Bill Gaslin, the Superintendent of Schools, said the School District is very proud of the gym and will pay for the wooden sign listing the names of patrons and companies who contributed to the gym restoration project. Mosman said she would redo her watercolor drawing into a brown print to be mounted on wood. The task force is considering several ideas for having something performed on the stage. There will be fund-raising events for more work that needs to be done. VII. NEW BUSINESS A. Sunbonnet Day Event Mosman said the Sunbonnet Day Committee is expecting the HPC to help that day, on Sunday, September 17, from noon to 4 p.m. The committee needs people who are knowledgeable about the historic house to answer questions and help with various activities. The HPC is also encouraged to ask friends and relatives to volunteer. Children can also help, with adult supervision. Mosman asked the Commissioners for help to clean the second floor, sweeping and cleaning windows, on September 16, from 9-10:30 a.m. Members were asked to bring cleaning materials. Gertz said he would supply pictures of the second floor for people who can't climb the stairs to see it themselves. Peterson-Benike made the suggestion to have old-fashioned clothes people can put on and have black and white photos taken wearing them. 2. Victorian Times Tea House in Woodbury Gertz said he talked to the owners. They did not acquire the house from the City. The City Council approved a Conditional Use Permit to renovate the house into a restaurant. They are required by city ordinance to live on the property. The owners have a Class B license to prepare food in their kitchen. The house can be rented for private parties also. Gertz suggested the HPC take a tour to visit the owners and find out how they worked with the City's Community Planning Board and City Council. 3. Peony Garden at Cummins-Grill House HERITAGE PRESERVATION COMMISSION MINUTES August 21, 2000 Page 8 Mosman said the Eden Prairie Garden Club has decided not to continue maintaining the peony garden. There are over 400 plants and the club members have put in about 420 man-hours over the last three seasons to maintain them. The members decided that the amount of work needed on a regular basis was getting to be a strain, and they have had to bring their own mowers, weed whips, and other gardening tools. Last spring the City found out too many different people had keys to various buildings, including the Cummins-Grill House, and changed the locks. The garden club would like to meet occasionally in the house, but was told they could no longer have a key and would have to request City Staff to let them in. They were also told they would be charged $25 per hour to hold meetings there. The garden club was irate about this. However, the City Council agreed the club should not be charged to meet there, and will be sending a letter commending them for all their work. Mosman said the garden club has asked to meet at the house on September 12th at 7 p.m. Gertz said he didn't think there would be any problem with this. He would discuss the security issue with Bob Lambert and also the matter of how the garden will be maintained in the future. Mosman said she told the Council the City should hire a professional company to look after it. The garden club has left it in a condition where it can now be maintained partly with larger equipment a few times a year rather than by hand on a weekly basis. Gertz and Mosman said they will find out how much it would cost to hire a professional gardener and present this information at the September meeting. VIII. ADJOURNMENT MOTION: Brown moved, seconded by Wroblewski, to adjourn the meeting. Chair Mosman adjourned the meeting at 9:15 p.m. The next meeting will be held at the Cummins-Grill House on September 18, 2000.