Planning Commission - 12/09/1974 AGENDA
Eden Prairie Planning Commission
Monday , December 9, 1974
7:30 PM City Hall
Invocation -- Pledge of Allegiance --- Roll Call
COMMISSION MEMBERS: Chairperson Schee, Wayne Brown, Don Sorensen. ,
Richard Lynch, Joan Meyers, M. E. Lane , Herb
Fosnocht.
STAFF MEMBERS: Richard Putnam, City Planner
I. MINUTES OF NOVEMBER 25, 1974 PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING.
II. MEMBERS REPORTS
A. Chariperson Schee
B. Other members
III. REPORTS AND RECOMMENDATIONS
A. Presentation by Robert Williams, Chairman of the Human Rights Commission, regarding
recommendation of changes to Ordinance 135 permitting Family Care Homes and
Group Care Homes.
Action: recommend to the City Council approval of the ordinance changes as proposed
by the Human Rights Commission amending Ordinance 135, deny, or continue.
B. Presentation by Alan Upton, Chairman of the Eden Prairie Bikeway/Hikeway Task Force
of the Task Force report.
Action: accept the Task Forte's comprehensive report forstudy with a recommendation
to the City Council considered at the December 23 rd Planning Commission
Meeting.
C. Presentation and discussion of the 4/5 Mini-Sector Study technical teams recommenda-
tions.
Action: accept the preliminary report for study with a recommendation to the City
Council ' . considered �- at the December 23rd Planning Commission Meeting.
D. Cedar Forest 2nd Addition, by Mr. & Mrs. Semrad requesting rezoning from rural
to R1-22 for 34 single familylots , preliminary plat approval and landhold agreement.
The site is located east of Ced3xForest 1st Addition and north of Riley Creek.
Action: Refer to the staff and watershed district for • review and report by the ecember
23rd Planning Commission meeting.
E. The Preserve Commercial Plan 200+ acre concept plan for the land surrounding the
Eden Prairie Center in the MCA. Presentation of overall concept and staff review
of plan for Area F located south of 169 and the Ring Road intersection.
Action: receive for study the total concept plan for the 200 acre plus area and
recommend approval for Area F's 34 acre commercial plan as modified to
the City Council, or deny, or continue.
Fp Red Rock Hills PUD, by John Houston, rezoning to R1-13.5 for 41 acres northeast of
Red Rock Lake and west of Scenic Heights. Requesting approval for approximately
80 single family lots. The project has been reviewed by the Park & Recreation
Commission and a staff report. is complete.
Action:recommend to the City Council that the Red Rock Hills Plan as presented in
the 11-1-74 brochure be denied based upon the Park & Recreation Commission
and staff report analysis,or approve as presented, or continue
Eden Prairie Planning Commission Agenda -2- Dec. 9, 1974
0 Village Woods 2nd Addition, by Zachman Homes a single family project . raquesting
rezoning from Rural in PUD 73-02 to RM 6.5 for - construction of 42 single family
homes on lots averaging 9000 sq. ft. located south of Scenic Heights and west
of Mitchell Road.
Action: Recommend approval of the modified plan suggested .in the Dec. 4th
staff report, or continue , or deny.
H. Linden Pond, By Edenvale Inc. ,requesting PUD development plan approval for the
multiple portion, preliminary plat approval_ and rezoning from PUD-70-04 to
RJ 13.5 of the single family portion. The proposed development project is in
conformance with thepeviously approved PUD 70-04.
Action: recommend approval of the Linden Pond project in conformance with the
December 4 staff report or deny or continue.
IV. AQOURNMENT.
•
• MINUTES v`� V. � •
Planning Commission Minutes -2- �. 9, 1974
EDEN PRAIRIE PLANNING COMMISSION
for residents who need it and live here or presently have to live outside the
Monday, December 9, 1974 7:30 PM City Hall community. Fosnocht asked if the benefit occurs to the home residents primarily
and therefore worthwhile for the community. Mr. Williams agreed.
MEMBERS PRESENT: Chairperson Schee, Don Sorensen, Joan Meyers, Herb Fosnocht,
Richard Lynch, Skip Lane Meyers asked if the Human Rights Commission had researched unsuccessful homes
MEMBERS ABSENT: Wayne Brown and determined why some are not successful and questioned if the proposed
STAFF PRESENT: Chris Enger, jean M. Egan amendment is sufficient to protect the community from unfortunate situations that have
--Sorensen chaired the meeting until Schee's arrival-- happened in other communities. Mr. Williams replied that there are not many
I. MINUTES OF NOVEMBER 25, 1974 PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING. homes in existence and they have not visited those that have not been suceesful,
P. 3 ,B, 1st A should read . . and have offered to install a private system . . . but they believe that if problems do arise they can be resolved by the City's current
Lynch moved, Lane seconded , to approve the minutes as published and changed. Nuisance Ordinance. Meyers then asked why they felt Family Care Homes would
The motion carried unanimously, not requirea public hearing . Williams said they believe the objections raised by
II. MEMBERS REPORT. residents lack true validity and they feel such homes can be handled administratively.
A. Chairperson Schee. not present at this time.
B. Other Members. Sorensen asked if problems could arise if a home resident was chemically dependent,
Mr. Sorensen asked when the MCA Report is expected to be printed as it would be most Williams said people can fall into multiple categories and with such cases the
helpful in reviewing some proposals. Mr. Enger said that a committee will be administrator must review the applicant and homes to determine a proper environment.
reviewing the bids next week. Mrs. Meyers added that the Council will be reviewing
the bids at their January 7th meeting. The commission members then questioned how neighborhoods shouldbe divided
In order to apply the 3% ratio. Mr. Enger said that presently it is anelusive
Sorensen then announced that it has been suggested by the City Manager that no conceptand that a method of delineating neighborhoods should be selected.
public hearings at the Council be held until January 14th. Williams added that neighborhoods would be established and approved by the
City Council.
III. REPORTS AND RECOMMENDATIONS.
-A. Presentation by Robert Williams, Chairman of the Human Rights Commission, regarding Schee suggested deleting the word ' alcoholic' on page 3 of the proposed amendment
changes to Ordinance 135 permitting Family Care Homes and Group Care Homes. under the category * Social Rehabilitation Programs .
Mr. Williams reported that the commission and the City staffbsce been seeking ways of Lynch asked if there would be a section to govern repealing approvals. Williams
providing family homes without the trying situations that have happened in other felt that a home would remain valid as long as it held a State License.
communities. The proposed amendment to the ordinance will provide family and group Motion:
carehomes and corresponding controls, He said the 3%limit is believed to be. Fosnocht moved, Schee seconded, to
reasonable and that the City attorney is expected to inspect the amendment for its legality 1. Recommend the City attorney review the draft ordinance amendment and
and conformance. He said the concept behind the amendment is toprovide an make specific wording changes to ensure proper legal conformance,
environment for all types of people in the community and the care home technique ordinance continuity , and provide the City of Eden Prairie with adequate
has proven itself to be much more effective in training and rehabilitating persons controls through procedures for licensing, renewal and/or revocation of
previously confined to institutions. licenses, penalities for violations, etc.
2. Recommend hattha City Council act upon the amendment to Zoning Ordinance
Mr,Lynch asked wly the proposed amendment is referred to as being timely. Williams 135 as proposed by the Human Rights Commission 'in accordance with
responded de-institutionalization is considered a better vehicle for rehabiltating, the recommendations of the City attorney.
and State and National policies are emphasizing the advariages of small scale services.
Lynch then asked if the homes would receive State funds. Williams believed that Vote: The motion carried•unanimously.
when the State does phase out larger institutions that money-would be provided for "
small scale facilities. Schee commanded the Human Rights Commission and City staff for their work on the
proposed ordinance change and encouragene tof Group Homes and rehabilitation
Mr. Lane asked for the definition of " disadvantaged " as used in the proposed facitities as it is forward step in community planning , She stated that it illustrates
amendment. Williams said that its definition would have to be clarified as the that the Human Rights commission is an important arm of government in thinking and
amendment becomes more finalized. planning.
Mr. Fosnocht asked what the direct benefits to the community would be if group and
care homes are provided.Williams said the benefit would be having'homes and programs
Planning Commission Minutes -4- ec. 9, 1974
PlanniOmmission Minutes -3- Dec. 9,19', y
Mr. Enger briefly backgounded the study: &showcd,the existing zoning and
B. Presentation by Alan Upton, Chairman of the Eden Prairie Hikeway/Bikeway land uses within the study area.
Task Force,of the Task Force Report.
Sorensen asked if the Cohen-Fuller-Stewart uses shown are approved uses.
Mr. Upton reported that 1 i years ago it was decided that the City needed trails Enger replied that it is an approved PUD which the attorney feels the City can
and a task force was formed to develop policies br hke and foot tails as they revoke if proven against City policy. Schee thought that the property'.had previoudly
seemed the mostimportant. He then read the objectives, priorities , and conclusion been. zoned commerdial .
contained in the Hikeway/Bikeway Task Force Report. He strongly recommended
pathway connection to the Major Center Area and adoption of the standards contained Meyers asked if the Westgate plat was still valid. Enger said that it is considered to be
In the report, residentially zoned but it is also considered anabondoned plat.
Mr. Enger said that definite alignments have not been outlined but rather trailway Sorensen asked if Pemton still interided to build on their property surrounding Mitchell
corridors because the task force felt it was important to present the policy statement Lake. Enger responded that. Pemton still intends to build subject to the market
to the policy makers to receive approval on the concept. He reported there are and money conditions.
possible funding sources for pathways and presently path costs range from$ 7,000-
30,000 per mile. He said that the surveys mailed out to gain citizen input had a Enger then proceeded with,the presentation of maps of soils within the area and
10%return. explained developability of the different soil classifications. He then presented
Mr. Fosnocht felt that the report was quite large and it would have been helpful the land use plan suggested bythe consultants if Alternate A is used :
if the standards -had been summarized so they are readily evident for NW Quadrant -neighborhood commercial(with possible institutional)
making recommendations. Enger replied that originally they wanted specific standards flanked on the west and northwest by residential. '
but the task force felt such standards might be inflexible. Fosnocht felt the City NE Quadrant -small com./ind, area along 5 (adjacent to the
should have concrete standards so developers readily knew what standards to eastern boundary of the studyl with the remainder
conform to . Fosnocht stated that if standards are to be adopted they should be of the quadrant as mixed residential.
defined ; or perhaps guidelines could be adopted. Schee agreed that guidelines SE Quadrant- industrial with the existing residential along Co. Rd.
may be better to adopt. 4 possibly going to industrial eventually.
Motion: Sorensen moved, Lane seconded, to . receive the' - Hikeway/Bikeway SW Quadrant- retention of the existing commercial (gas station )
Task Force Report and extend thblr appreciation to the staff and task force and the remainder in mixed residential.
and place the item on the December 23rd agenda.
Discussion Mr. Steinmann asked what access there would be for the gas station at the 4/5
Sorensen complimented the' staff and task force and stated - that the Council intersection. Enger replied that the access north on Co. Rd. 4 would be eliminated
has a difficult decision facintjthem,and cost of the paths will be a very important with only 1 way access to Highway 5. Mr. Enger then pointed out and explained
consideration. Fosnocht believed that when an operational plan is prepared that the the accesses proposed for 4 & 5 with the alternate A road plan and land use plan
costs will be more evident. Mr. Upton said that if the conceptual plan is acceptable suggested by the consultants.
they will do more indepth work on the report. Meyers said that the Council received
the report lastweek and referred it to the Planning Commission and directed it to the Sorensen asked if the area near the 'Little Red Store' was considered as a neighborhood
staff and Park & Recreation Commission for a funding study. Fosnocht wished to commercial site. Enger said that the consultants felt such a site was not large enough.
express deep' thanks to the task force. Mr. George Carter asked If there was a Meyers disagreed with the land use of a commercial center at the 4/5 intersection
Hennepin County program for pathways . Schee replied that she was not sure, and felt that it would require an underpass to serve the residential area east of
Vote: The motion carried unanimously. Co. Rd. 4 . Enger informed them that the area is presently zoned commercial and
said he felt the study team considered the existing zoning and the Guide Plan when
C. Presentation and discussion of the 4/5 Mini-Sector Study technical team's recommenda- selecting the land use proposed. Fosnocht shared Meyers conc.,rn and asked that the
tions. study team consider alternate commercial sites such as; the southern edge of
Westgate, or north and south of the Red Store. Enger replied that the study team
Schee requested that the Planning Commission receive the 4/5 report a week before had considered those sites and felt those sites were too visible and buffering
the meeting if at all possible otherwise the members may not have adequate time between the commercial and residential would be difficult to obtain.
to review it thoroughly. Fosnocht suggested that staff reports over 15 pages
should have an attached summary 1/10 as long. Sorensen agreed that -it would be
helpful to have a summary along with indepth reports
' Plannie—ommission Minutes -5- Dec. 9, 1970
Plannntng Commission Minutes -6- loc. 9, 1974
Sorensen asked if the NW corner could be proposed as office/institutional uses. Meyers asked if the proposed first phase would have the ability for future expansion.
Enger replied that such uses would be possible at that corner. Galpin replied that It would be possible to increase the intensity of development
after the first generation buildings. He added that the first phase buildings will be
Due to the heavy agenda Schee suggested that the commission move onto other 1-2 stories and did not feel such uses warranted an pedestrian overpass.
items.
Mr. Enger then highlighted the staff report which concentrated on Area F's development.
Mr. Don Peterson said he felt neighborhood commercial meant stores similar to He cited the main problem of the clinic site as high exposure to 169 and suggested
'PDQ s' and other small shops and asked what type of definition is used for that detailed designs as to elevations and screening be submitted to the staff. He
neighborhood commercial and community commercial centers. said the planning staff recommends approval with the addition of pedestrian/bike
paths and an amendment to the site plan which would allow more creative design
Fosnocht suggested that the study team decide what would be considered neighborhood in • the pads , parking lots, etc. Meyers reaffirmed the comments in the
commercial centers as ppgosed to community commercial centers. staff report as to the necessity of paths.
Mrs. Megert asked where the access would be north of Highway 5 to the abandoned Galpin questioned whether the area would require a pedestrian system immediately
Westgate area. Enger responded that with alternate A the .access would be on the because in working the HNTB the area is considered to have a higher auto orientation
existing Ihcktop or on a realigned Fuller Road. Mrs. Riegert felt that if the access than pedestrian.
was up the existing blacktop it would make their land unusable.
Motion: Lynch moved, Fosnocht seconded, to continue the item to the December 23rd Sorensen said he would encourage a people moving system now otherwise it might
agenda providing a report is received one week prior to the meeting, not be developed. He considered such a system necessary to allow movementfrom Eden-
The motion carried unanimously. vale South (the area south of the Preserve Commercial Center) to the Homart Center.
D. Cedar Forest 2nd Addition, by Semrad, requesting rezoning from rural to R1-22 for Fosnocht asked how far of a trip it would be from the center of the Homart site to the
34 single familylots, preliminary plat approval and a landhold agreement. The Preserve Commercial site's southern boundary. Galpin estimated the distance to be about
site is located east of Cedar Forest 1st Addition and north of Riley Creek. 3,000 feet and considered such a distance too far to carry back major Items or
Engers stated that the staff would be working with the Semards and informed the grocery bags. Fosnocht then asked if a pedestrian system would be provided in
Area F . Galpin responded that a system would be outlined in the final plan. Fosnocht
commission that the Semrads were willing to develop a landhold agreement. felt people will be crossing the Ring Road to get to Homart and that such a trip
although considered a long walk would be reasonable for a biker. Galpin suggested
Sorensen referring to the December 2nd letter from the Semrads asked them if they an on-grade crossing be made south of the center. Fosnocht then asked how the
had been notified of the rezoning of their property to rural. Mrs. Semrad said 2nd generation facilities are obtained. Galpin replied that the 2nd generation buildings
that they received no notification of the rezoning. Sorensen requested the staff would be utilizing on-grade or vertical rise. Fosnocht asked if they disagreed with
to clarify why Semrads had not received notification of the rezoning. the recommendations In the staff report. Galpin said they basically accept the recommenda-
Motion: Lynch moved, Sorensen seconded, to continue the item to the December 23rd tions and will provide for pedestrian through trips but they do not feel they are
agenda for a staff report. The motion carried unanimously, acquiring the benefit and therefore they should be required to install an overpass.
E. The Preserve Commercial Plan 200 acre concept plan for the land surrounding the Eden
Prairie Center in the MCA. Presentation of overall concept and staff review of plan Lane stated that six years ago tenants in the Southdale office building were told that
for Area F located south of 169 and the Ring Road intersection. an overpass would be constructed and he wished the City of Edina had required it
Loren Galpin, of Development Concepts, presented the commercial plan of approximately because nothing has been built to-date.
200 acres. He outlined the various areas (A- H ) contained in the plan and the Sorensen felt the pedestrian link should be provided for because there will be more
corresponding proposed uses of office, restaurant apartment, commercial , and traffic than the Ring Road can safely handle and t1mrefore alternate means of transportation
recreational. In Area F , the western 5 acres proposed for a clinic site, Mr. Galpin should be included. Galpin said a system would be handled in the final plan and
stated that their plan will respect the slope and site , and that they have met with the suggested there be a benefit sharing policy.
watershed district. In regards to the path connection from the commercial area
across the Ring Road to the Homart Shopping Center he said that it is a good idea,-but they Mr. George Carter, of The Preserve, said there is a use for pedestrian systems
consider its construction unnecessary until warranted by development intensity. throughout and they would supply the area for a system. He stated that the final plan
would respect the slopes and move people. He said that they would not build a
• Planning Commission Minutes -8- ~
Planning�miss[on Minutes -7- Dec. 9,1974 Dec. 9, 1974
bridge over the Ring Road and suggested an on-grade crossing at Franlo Road. Motion:
Sorensen moved, Lane seconded, the Planning Commission recommend that the
Fosnocht believed either abridge or some alternative was needed to proWde safe
developer work with the staff to bring the proposal in conformance with the December
4th staff report recommendatiorEand the comments made by the commission this
crossing of the Ring Road. evening, and if the developer does not comply the commission recommends denial
Sorensen stated that the commission was not unmindful of the large cost of development of the proposal. The motion carried unanimously.
but he felt developers should share in the cost of making pedestrian systems safe.
Mr. Gene Martlnson,8317 Red Rock Road, reaffirmed the existing residents concern
Carter said they would provide a way for people to get to Homart and asked that the City
about traffic on Red Rock Road.
suggest a way of paying for it. Sorensen asked if the Preserve would pay their
reasonable share. Carter responded that he could not say at this time. 3, Village Woods 2nd Add., by Zachman Homes. a single family project requesting
Motion: rezoning from Rural in PUD 73-02 to RM 6,5 for construction of 42 single family
Fosnocht moved, Meyers seconded, to continue the study of The Preserve Commercial homes on lots averaging 9000 sq. ft. located south of Scenic Heights and west
Plan and Area F 'until December 23rd , to instruct the staff to work with the developer of Mitchell Road.
and itemize the changes referred to in recommendation#2 and provide the commission
with a list of changes the developer agrees to and does not agree to, and report if Enger reviewed the staff report coverning such areas as the 12 acre dedicated open
the developer's position is acceptable to the City. The motion carried-unanimously. space, request for rezoning to RM 6.5, 0 lot line homes, 30, setbacks from the
F. Red Rock Hills PUD, by John Houston, rezoning to R1-13.5 for 41 acres northeast of right-of-way, 60' Instead of the 70' rtght-of-way previously suggested,
the
Red Rock Lake and west of Scenic Heights. Requesting approval for approximately 80 suggestion that a path system be constructed 6 feet wide and of a hard d material.
single family lots. The project has been reviewed by the Park & Recreation Commission
and a staff report is complete. Sorensen asked how the residents on the north side c€the long cul-de-sac would get
to the path system. Enger suggested that outlots be used at the end of the cul-de-
E nger pointed-out the open water area that the developer proposes to dedicate (which sac and another at the end of the road. Sorensen then asked if the staff suggestion
already may be owned by the public), the high plateau, the necessary cut & fills, regarding the path system would make some lots under 7500 sq. ft. Enger replied
and how the lots would be platted to the lake's edge. He reported that the planning that if the lots were shifted somewhat it would alleviate that from ha
and engineering staff concur that revision could be made to the existing curb cuts in peening.
the northeast corner and that a 60 foot right-of-way would be adequate.for Village Mr. Jim Zachman stated that the staff's suggestion on paths would total about 1 mile
Woods Drive. He recpmmended the developer phase the project until another access of paths and would cost about$ 25,000. Lynch questioned why
could be made and that lots fronting on the collector should have 'T' driveways. sidewalks. Zachman replied that paths are wider and are hand lad and therefore
e than
He believed that a path is possible along the lake on the existing snowmobile/foot Cost more, He suggested
trail. Phase,It is the Park & Recreation Commission's recommendation trhave the developr that the paths along the west considered In the next
se, and that paths were not necessary for the few homes along the street. Meyers
dedicate 6 lots along the lakeshore but he reported the planning staff suggests a felt the people on ment
reasonable width for a path plus the steeper wooded slopes and outlot be dedicated. &'that requiring paths along
along the street may of be necessary.oShe hen the path easugges
suggested
that the backs of lots adjacent to the play area be biffered. Zachman said he had not
Mr. John Houston said he would be willing to work with the staff regarding the planned to buffer that area because the
Items In the report, and said the was extremely concerned about the staff's opinion park would not be for lighted uses.
that the area he proposes to dedicate may be owned by the pubic and if it was he Meyers asked If landscaping was included with the houses. Zachman replied that
would apologize. there would be and added that the primary entrance would also be landscaped.
Sorensen said he was under . the understanding that the State owns all lakes to the Meyers stated that some people have complained thatthe first addition had a`fact
low water mark and access to the high water mark.-He felt the project would require or y
appearance and asked if more vatiety would be used as suggested in recommmendation
a variance if it is seeking rezoning to 13.5 because it's density exceeded 2 units/ #S. Enger responded that it could be accomplished with siting , color, setbacks,
acre. .He then suggested the devekperwork with the staff further before the commission etc., adding that the planning-staff felt there was adequate variety now,
takes action. Houston stated that the density was 2.05 u/a. Sorensen replied that the
density would be higher if the marsh is State owned. Lynch asked what the homes mould sell for. Zachman said they would cost between
$41,000-46,000. Lynch then asked what the sq. ft. would be. Zachman estimated
the square footage to be 936-1,100 sq. ft.
Pffing Commission Minutes -9- Dec. 9, 1970
Motion:
Lynch moved,, Lane seconded, to recommend approvalof;the rezoning from Rural and
PUD to RM 6.5, preliminary plat approval on phase 2 of Village Woods Neighbohood 1
concept as townhouses to 0 lot line homes, as per the staff report dated December
4th with the following changes in the recommendations and one addition:
In recommendation#4 delete the sentence beginning with "Besides and
ending with Circle.
Recommendation #6 should read-
That the developer be required to obtain staff approval on the siting of
units in such a way that they fit the terrain and not make the terrain fit
the units.
Add an additional recommendation -
12. The following setbacks are to apply
Minimum side setbacks 5 feet
Minimum distance between .houses 15 feet
Minimum distance between house & garage 15 feet
Minimum distance between garage & garage 10 feet
Vote: The motion carried unanimously.
H. Linden Pond, by Edenvale Inc., requesting PUD development plan-approval for the ;
multiple portion, preliminary plat approval and rezoning from PUD 70-04 to RI-13.5 -
of the single family portion. The proposed development project is in conformance with
the previously approved PUD 70-04.
The item was not covered by the commission and no one from Edenvale was present.
IV. ADJOURNMENT,
Lane moved, Schee seconded , to adjourn at 2:05 AM. The motion carried unanimously.