Planning Commission - 09/17/1974 AGENDA
Eden Prairie Planning Commission
Tuesday, September 17, 1974
7:30 PM City Hall
Invocation - Pledge of Allegiance - Roll Call
I. MINUTES OF SEPTEMBER 3, 1974 PLANNING COMMISSION MINUTES.
II, REPORTS AND RECOMMENDATIONS
A. Homart Development Company, Homart Eden Prairie Center,presentation of
final site plan, landscaping, signage, parking and pedestrian system.
The plan is the final step prior to letting bids for the landscaping for the
113 acre Eden Prairie Center located south of the ' Y " in the MCA.
Suggested Action: Recommend approval of the site plan , graphics, and
landscaping plan for the Eden Prairie Center as submitted in the plan dated
September 17, 1974 A. D. , or continue or deny.
Continued Public Hearings from September 3, 1974
B. Flood Plain Ordinance . An ordinance designating the flood plain , marshes,
wetlands, watercourses, and lands abutting meandered lakes in the City
and regulating the use and development thereof. The final draft of the
Ordinance with the suggested options as requested by the Commission has
been distributed.
Suggested Action: Recommend approval of the Flood Plain Ordinance with
modifications noted in the Planning Commission Minutes of September 17th,
or continue , or deny.
C. Outlot A, Crestwood 73, by Alex Dorenkemper. Request for division of Outlot A
into 3 lots and a rezoning to R1-22 . The site is located in southwestern Eden
Prairie adjacent to Crestwood Terrace in the Maplewood Estates single family
subdivision.
Suggested Action: Motion to approve the rezoning request for Outlot A of
Crestwood 73 to R1-22 and recommendation to approve the land division into
3 lots, or continue , or deny.
III. PETITIONS AND REQUESTS
A. Worth Oil Co. request rezoning to C-Hwy for the existing DX station at the
intersection . of Highway 4 & 5 for the use as a Holiday Station Store and
auto service center. The property is currently zoned Rural and would require
rezoning to C-Hwy as per the requirements of Ordinance 135. The developers
presentation of proposed station modifications.
Suggested Action: Motion to continue until October 14, 1974 and to refer
to staff for a report, or approve, or deny
IV. COMMISSION MEMBERS REPORTS
A. Chairwoman Schee.
1.Discussion of meeting changes and requirements for packet delivery
B. Council Representative Meyers
1. City Council action on Neighborhood Facilities Study and joint Meeting with
Park & Recreation Commission. .
AGENDA -2- September 17, 1974
Eden Prairie Planning Commission
• B. Council Representative Meyers
2 . City Council action on completion of MCA Report.
3 City Council action requesting staff and commission to prepare outline for
MCA development ordinance.
C. Board of Appeals Representative Sorensen
1, Discussion of Set-Back Ordinance changes
2.The charge of the Board of Appeals and its function
V. PLANNER"S REPORT
A. Meeting with the Outreach Community Center , October: 7, 1974 , at 7:00 PM
to tour and discuss group home concept , sponsered by the Human Rights
Commission.
B. Seminar at Normandale Community College on Planning and Zoning.
C. Smetana Lake Resolution and Ordinance requested by City Council
D. City attorney's opinion of the status for PS districts.
E, Report on the planners meeting with St. John's Woods Homeowners Association.
VI. ADJOURNMENT.
MINUTES
EDEN PRAIRIE PLANNING COMMISSION
Tuesday, September 17, 1974 7:30 PM City Hall
MEMBERS PRESENT: Schee, Lane, Sorensen, Fosnocht, Lynch, Meyers
MEMBERS ABSENT: Brown
STAFF PRESENT: Dick Putnam, City Planner
I, MINUTES OF SEPTEMBER 3 , 1974 PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING.
P. 2 , 3rd P, should read- Mr. Fosnocht suggested the Commission. . .
P. 3 , 4th F, should read-Mr. Fosnocht expressed the concern that their actions tend
to force people into high cost property and that by these actions they
enforce the marketing policies of such properties.
P. 5 , under the Discussion it should read-Mr. Fosnocht stated that he could not
support the request as submitted but opposed the motion because
it did not leave Mr. Riegert any alternatives.
P. 5, 2nd P, should read-Mr. Sorensen felt the motion did not deny different
approaches, rather it set out exact reasons and it was the specific
and backgrounded type of action he feels is appropriate a for the
Commission and ;Council to take in order to provide basis for future
action and support in cases of court proceddings.
P. 5 , under Flood Plain Ordinance; 3rd F, should read - Mr. Fosnocht asked
why it was necessary to have a minimum of 100'.easement on
property outside of the flood plain.
• Lane moved, Sorensen seconded, to approve the Minutes as published and corrected.
The motion carried with 4 ayes and 2. abstains, ( Meyers and Lynch ) .
I I. REPORTS AND RECOMMENDATIONS.
A. Homart Development Company, Homart Eden Prairie-Center , presentation of
final site plan, landscaping, signage, parking and pedestrian system.
The plan is the final step prior to letting bids for the landscaping -for the
113 acre Eden Prairie Center located south of the ' .Y ' in the MCA.
Herb Baldwin presented the initial planting phase of the Eden Prairie Center,
and through the use of slides he showed the various aspects of the plan such as;
lighting, signage, pedestrian circulation ways, vehicular movement, etc,
Included in the signage program are 5 entrance markers ( 20 feet off the right-of-way
line ) , a cinema sign, stop signs at critical areas, yield signs, one-way signs,
etc. The entrance markers will be 12 feet high and the regional identification
pylon will be 60 feet high with a 12' x 12 ' base located along 169/212.
Mr. Fosnocht questioned if 60 ' would be necessary for they regional pylon.
Mrs. Meyers asked if the staff had reviewed the signage plan . The planner said
the staff had not had the plan to evaluate it.
Mr. Fosnocht felt it may be inappropriate to use the Eden Prairie logo.on the
regional pylon . Mrs. Schee replied that the original intent was to have
Homart use something similar to the Eden Prairie logo.
Eden Prairie Planning Commission Minutes -2- Sept. 17, 1974
Mr. Baldwin statedthe plant material in the location of the 3rd & 4th stores
would be transplanted to other areas within the Homart site when the
3rd & 4th stores come in.
Mr. Sorensen asked if they expected the Commission's approval on landscaping
to encompass the signage. Mr. Baldwin replied affirmative.
Mr. Lynch asked what would be used to assist shoppers in finding their
parked, cars . Dale Hamilton, a Homart representative, replied that the store
doors would be color coded. Mr. Lynch then armed how much taller the
identification pylon was compared to the building. Mr. Hamilton responded
that it is 514" taller than the building.
Mr. Sorensen asked if the 6 semaphores shown on the Homart plan along the
Ring Route were included in the Ring Road assessment . The planner said that
there would not be 6 semaphores when the road opens. Mr. Spinks added
that the assessment plan will coincide with the up-grading of 169.
Mrs Meyers asked if they knew how far the pylon could be seen-from the
road systems. Mr. Hamilton replied that it could be seen when driving
on I-494,
Motion: 1
Lane moved, Lynch seconded, to recommend approval of the landscaping and
lighting plan presented by Homart, subject to reasonable modification through
work with the City staff, and to refer the plan and the 9-16-74 staff report
to the City Council for their information The motion carried unanimously.
Motion: 2
Sorensen moved, Lane seconded to recommend the signage plan to the staff
for a report and recommendations. The motion carried unanimously.
B. Flood Plain Ordinance. An ordinance designating the flood plain, marshes,
wetlands, . watercourses, and lands abutting meandered lakes in the City
and regulating the use and development thereof. The final draft of the
ordinance with the suggested options as requested by the Commission has
been distributed.
The planner reported that the state does not require a 100' easement. He
also reported that the Park & Recreation Commission voted in favor of
option A in the 8-2 8-74 memo from Mr. Jessen, and referred them to the
letter from Edenvale,
Mr. Sorensen made the following comments & suggestions on the flood plain
ordinance.
- the introduction of the ordinance covers meandered lakes but the
text does not.
- P. 2, item ( e) after the word 'debris'-runoff or sediment-should be
included.
Eden Prairie Planning Commission Minutes -3- Sept. 17, 1974
- P. 5, ( b) , Ist P, quotation marks should be removed after the word City"
- P. 7, ( 3 ) , 4th line , ' of the City ' should read - ' in the City' ,
- P. 7 , ( 6 ) , line 2 , instead of ' essential' use reasonably necessary
- P. 10 , ( a } , { l ) , research what other types of structures could cause
the same problem as residential.
- P. 11 , 6th line refers to paragraph ( d ) of section 9 and there is no
paragraph ( d ) in section 9.
- P. 12 ( a ) should have definition of Flood Plain District, ( b ) 6th line
should read and/or obstructions,
P.; 13 ( f ) between the words ' with the ' insert - staff reports and
- P. 15 ( a ),suggest elimination of ' City Manager and as the case
may be' , the same on P. 16 # 12 ( b ) .
Meyers suggested that there . be a procedure for permitting minor variances
other than by Council action.
• - P. 16 9 should read to the"'.'City''s overall water management lan. '. .
( ) Y g p
- P. 19 ( b ) 3rd line, suggest deleting 'granted pursuant hereto'
& include after the word permit in the same line or existing prior
to the adoption of this ordinance to the extent provided herein.
- P, 19, section 13, 4th line , delete shall and insert may be ordered to
pay
-P. 20 , section 16 should ._read Chapter 104 not 105.
--P. 21 , section 20 should read Chapter 104 not 105.
Mr. Fosnocht suggested the ordinance have varying restrictions on what can
occur in the 0-20 year flood plain compared to the 2 0-100 year flood plain.
Mr. Sorensen believed that there could be a difference in the intrepretation
of the language in section 5 becaus.e the flood plain is taken to mean 100'
from the channel and in b ( 1 ) a measurement of 100' from the nearest bank is
referred to. Mr. Sorensen suggested that the staff investigate language that
would outline restictions for ingress and egress
Meyers asked why , given these stated concerns the Watershed District
recommends 100 ' , The planner responded that it is considered necessary
for water management.
Eden Prairie Planning Commission Minutes -4- Sept. 17, 1 g7/-
Mr. Don Peterson, of Eden Land Corporation, suggested ( a ) & ( b ) •
in section 5 be rewritten because it is conflicting and confusing.
Mr. Sorensen asked where within the City 50 ' might be insufficient . The
planner said he was not sure but the ordinance does have a variance procedure
to handle such instances.
Mr. Frank Smetana Jr. suggested that section 5 be deleted and stated that
he did not believe everyone would apply for permits.
Mr. Fosnocht felt 50 ' may be reasonable in some areas and that the
chain of actions to obtain a permit were too involved and time consuming.
Mr. Sorensen asked what was meant by flood plain district. The planner
stated that it is the area designated as flood plain on the Zoning Map.
Motion 1 :
Sorensenmoved, Lane seconded, to amend section 5 ( a ) . 3rd line , to read
after Fiood Plain, or within .100' of the nearest bank of the channel' , and
amend - section 5 ( b ) ( 1 ) to provide for minimum situation of 50' .
Vote- on Motion # 1
The motion carried with 4 ayes, 1 nay ( Fosnocht ) , and 1 abstain ( Lynch }.
Motion 2 •
Meyers moved, Lane seconded, to incorporate into section 4 ( a ) in addition
to flood plain profile the same language suggested for 5 ( a ) , to read -
`profi-le, and 100 ' of the nearest bank of the channel'.
Mr. Sorensen called question on the motion. The question, carried unanimously.
Vote: on Motion #2
The motion carried with 4 ayes, 1 nay ( Fosnocht ) and 1 abstain ( Lynch }
Motion 3
Sorensen moved, Lane seconded to amend 5 ( b) ( 1 ) to read 50 ' instead of lOQ'
Mr. Fosnocht moved to amend the motion by deleting item 5 ( b ) ( 1 ) and
substitute option # 2 from the 8-28-74 memo changing the 100' to 501 .
Mrs. Schee stated that Mr. Fosnocht's motion was a substitute motion and
that Mr. Sorensen's motion must be voted upon first.
Mr. Fosnocht withdrew his motion.
Vote: on Motion #3
Mr. Sorensen's motion carried with 5 ayes and 1 abstain ( Lynch) .
Planning Commission Minutes -5- Sept. 17, 1974
Mr. Don Peterson asked if platting would be allowed within the'100 ` easement.
• Mr. Sorensen said that he did not feel that the ordinance prohibited platting,
and that it might be recommended to the Council that the ordinance does
not specifically adress itself to "the subject of platting.
Motion 4
Fosnocht moved, Meyers seconded, to delete section 5 ( b ) ( I ) and insert
option 2 of the 8-28-74 memo changing the 100' dimension to 50' .
L`iscussion•
Mr. Sorensen felt an option for dedication is appropriate in certain instances
and removal of the dedication option would make him vote against the motion.
Mr. Frank Smetana believed that the option to dedicate exists anyway and'does
not have to be in the ordinance.
Mr. Lane called question on the motion. The question carried unanimously.
Vote: on Motion #4
Mr. Fosnocht's motion.failed with 4 nays, 1 aye ( Fosncoht ) and I abstain,
( Lynch } ,
Motion 5
Meyers moved, Sorensen seconded= to recommned the 4th option in the
8-28-74 memo changing 100' to 50' .
Mr. Sorensen called question on the motion. The . question carried unanimously.
Vote: on Motion #5
The motion carried with 5 ayes, and 1 abstain ( Lynch-) .
Mr. Sorensen referring to P. 12 ( c ) suggested that the fee bear a relationship
to the man'hours involved and the administrative procedures should be _
lessened so that Council time would not be needed to approve such things
as clothesline poles.
The Commission members all agreed that there should be major/minor
procedures and a sliding fee schedule.
Mr. Fosnocht felt there was a discrepancy in ( d ) & ( f ) in section 7
regarding submission of applications.
Motion 6
Mr. Fosnocht moved, Lane seconded, that the words, the appropriate
Watershed District and Department of Natural Resources' be deleted
in ( f ),section 7,and insert, " Park & Recreation and the Planning
Commission. And add-- Comments from the appropriate Watershed
District and the Department of Natural Resources shall be forwarded to
the City Council if they are available.
Planning Commission Minutes -6- Sept, 17, 1974
Discussion:
Mr. Sorensen felt that statute 104 required submission. •
The planner asked for clarification of their feelings regarding submission
such as; is submission only necessary or must a reply be received.
Amendment to Motion I6
Mr, Fosnocht moved to amend the motion, Lane seconded, that the staff
should investigate if it is permissible under Statute 104.
Vote: on Motion #6 & Amendment
The motion and amendment carried with 5 ayes and 1 abstain ( Lynch ) .
Motion 7
Sorensen moved, Lane seconded, that procedures for minor variances
and a sliding fee schedule be recommended to the Council. The motion
carried with 5 ayes and 1 abstain ( Lynch ) .
Mrs. Meyers suggested that a flood plain profile be available before the
Council 'holds a public hearing on the flood plain ordinance.
C. Outlot A , Crestwood 73 , By Alex Dorenkemper. Request for division of Outlot
A into 3 lots and a rezoning to R1-22.. The site is located in.southwestern _
Eden Prairie adjacent to Crestwood'Terrace in the Maplewood Estates single
family subdivision. .
The planner reviewed the material relative to the platting and rezoning in the
final plan in which lots 1 6-18 were not platted &ft road built by Mr. Dorenkemper
was 180 ' not the 135 ' referred to by Carl Tullie
He then outlined the 3 options in the 1-6-74 staff report.
Mrs. Meyers asked if the existing street services all 3 lots. The planner
said lots 4 & 5 were and that it would be possible for'lot 6 to be serviced
by the street.
Mr. Sorensen asked if the City Attorney had given an opinion on
option 2 . The planner responded negative.
Mr. Dorenkemper stated that some of the dates quoted in the staff
report were wrong. The planner said he may have misquoted some of the
dates from the numerous material he reviewed while , writing the report.
Mr. Dorenkemper said he was not , aware that a certified resolution
was required when filing a final plat , _ Mrs. Holmgren dd not supply him
with one, and the County at the time of filing did not ask for one. He stated
that the City supplied the certified resolution for the initial platting and,
that he believed it was planned deception , or an error, not to let the other plat
be filed.
Mr. Sorensen asked how he knew the City paid the filing- fee for his plat.
Mr. Dorenkemper said he was not sure but supposed the City couldlave charged him
him for it at a later date.
Planning Commission Minutes 7- Sept. 17, 1974
Mr. Sorensen asked Mr. Dorenkemper if he filed the 2nd plat. Mr. Dorenkemper
isaid he had but since he did not have a certified resolution it was not filed legally.
He added that no one at the County asked him for a certified resolution.
The planner asked Mr. Dorenkemper if his attorney or engineering firm had
advised him to obWn a certified resolution. Mr. Dorenkemper responded
negative.
After reviewing the plats Mr. Sorensen stated that the first plat was for a
road,and nothing else,and that the City could have paid the fee since the
road was dedicated,
The planner suggested that to expedite the matter Mr. Dorenkemper and his
attorney should meet with the City attorney and staff to' resolve the questions .
Schee agreed and askedthat Dorenkemper. and his legal council meet with the
staff and City attorney to resolve the matters so the City may take action.
Motion:
Fosnocht moved, Sorensen seconded,that the request for land division and
rezoning be denied in accordance with recommendation # 1 in the 9-6-74
staff report. The motion carried unanimously.
III. PETITIONS AND REQUESTS.
• A. Worth Oil Co. , request rezoning to-,C-Hwy for the existing DX station at the
intersection of Highway 4 & 5 for use as a Holiday Station Store and
auto service center. The property is currently zoned Rural. and would require
rezoning to C-Hwy as per the requirements of Ordinance 135.
The planner reported that the site is zoned Rural and that the City attorneys
opinion is that the station is a non-conforming use and rezoning should be
applied for.
Mr. Bob Daly, a representative from Worth Oil ,said they would be submitting
their design changes soon. Mr. Carlson, from the company`s engineering department
said they would be -proposing an addition to the building which would
extend 40 feet to the west.
Mr. Sorensen expressed the concern that based upon the Guide Plan and
previous actions, ( regarding commercial at the same corner ) , that commercial
zoning is inappropriate. Mr, Lynch shared the same concern.
The planner said that the City attorney would be submitting a report on
PS Districts,
Meyers asked the representatives if they would be willing to operate the
building as a station only. Mr. Carlson responded no they would not.
IV. COMMISSION MEMBERS REPORTS.
A. Chairwoman Schee
7 Discussion of meeting changes and requirements for packet delivery.
Due to the 2nd and 4th Monday in -October being holidays Mrs. Schee
Planning Commission Minutes -8- Sept. 17, 1974
suggested the Planning Commission meet the 3rd and 5th Tuesday of
that month •
Motion:
Lane moved, Lynch seconded, to reschedule the Planning Commission's
October meetings to the 3rd and 5 th Tuesday. (Oct. i 5 & 29th
Mrs. Schee suggested the packets for the meetings be delivered on
the Wednesdays before the regular Planning Commission meetings of the
grid & 4th Mondays of the month. -
B. Council Representative Meyers.
I . City Council action on Neighborhood Facilities Study and Joint Meeting
with Park & Recreation Commission.
Mrs. Meyers reported that 3 Council members met with the Park &
Recreation commission and passed a resolution encouraging work on the
study,
2, City Council action on completion of MCA report.
She reported that this item would be on the Council's September 24th agenda.
C. Board of Appeals Representative Sorensen
I. Discussion of Setback Ordinance changes.
Mr. Sorensen reported that the City attorney was working on the changes.
2 . The charge of the Board of Appeals and its function.
He informed the commission members that the Council will be modifying
the . charge of the Board of Appeals to some extent.
V. PLANNER'S REPORT. •
A. Meeting with the Outreach Community Center, October 7, I974, at 7:00 PM
to tour and discuss group home concept, sponsered by the Human Rights Commission.
The planner reviewed the date and time of the tour.
B. Seminar at Normandale Community College on Planning and Zoning
This item was briefly covered by Chairwoman Schee at the beginning of the
of the meeting. She urged the members to attend if at all possible
C. Smetana Lake Resolution and Ordinance requested by City Council.
Due to the late hour C & D were not discussed
D. City attorney's opinion of the status for PS districts.
E. Report on the planner's meeting with St. John's Woods Homeowners Association.
The planner informed the commission of his meeting with the St. John Woods
HOA and expressed the need of holding discussions and meetings with
the Homeowners Associations in the City.
VT. ADJOURNMENT.
Meyers moved, Lynch seconded, to adjourn at 1:I7 AM.
The motion carried unanimously.
i