Planning Commission - 10/03/1972 PROPOSED AGENDA
EDEN PRAIRIE PLANNING CO MISSION
TUESDAY, QCTO!lER 3, 1972
7:30 P.M. EDEN PRAIRIE VILLAGE HALL
INVOCATION -- PLEDGE Of ALLEGIANCE -- ROLL CALL
COMMISSION ?1EMBERS: Chairman Norma Schee, Chairman Pro-Tem Herb
F so nocht, Secretary Wayne Brown, Roqer Boerger, Ralph Nesbitt,
Don Sorensen, Patrick Casey, Jammie Mikelson.
COMMISSION STAFF: Robert P. Heinrich, Village Manager;
Dick Putnam, Planner
I. MINUTES OF SEPTEMBER 19, 1972 MEETING.
II. REPORTS AND RECOMENDATIONS
A. Mark Z. Jones, Shadow Green, apartments and neighborhood commercial
center located in Edenvale near Valley View and !1itchell Road.
Staff report and Commission recommendation.
B. The Preserve, Addition Two to Highpoint single family area in phase I.
Report and recommendations.
111. PETITIONS AND REQUESTS
A. Hilliam Dredge application for property subdivision on Summit Drive
over-Took ngMedrock Lake.
B. Ecklund Pt Swedlund, Hidden Ponds, 150 acre single family detailed
subdivision located south of Duck Lake Trail extending west to
T.H. 101 . Request rezoning and preliminary plat approval on 150
acre proposal . Preliminary staff report.
C. Hirsh Development Corporation, townhouses and patio homes, located
north of Olympic Hill Golf Course in The Preserve. Request rezoning
and first stage preliminary plat approval.
D. Preferred Developers Corporation, Meadow Wood, a 180 unit rental
apartment project located in The Preserve, west of the proposed
community center. Preliminary report.
E. Warren Shultz, single family plat located on County Road #4 be-
tween Kurtz Lane and Terrace Drive. Presentation and staff report.
MINUTES
EDEN PRAIRIE PLANNING COMMISSION
Tuesday, October 3, 1972 7:3 0 P.M. Village Hall
INVOCATION PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE ROLL CALL
Members present: Chairwoman, Norma Schee; Chairman Pro-Tem, Herb
Fosnocht; Secretary, Wayne Brown; Roger Boerger, Don Sorenson, and Jamie
Mikelson. Also present was Dick Putnam, Eden Prairie Village Planner.
I. MINUTES OF SEPTEMBER 19, 1972 .
Approval of minutes was delayed until the next meeting.
II. REPORTS AND RECOMMENDATIONS
A. Mark Z. Tones, Associates, Shadow Green, rental apartment project
located in Edenvale PUD - the new intersection of Valley View and Mitchell
Road.
The Commission received the Planning Staff Report dated September 15 , 1972,
and the Planner briefly discussed the recommendations included in the report.
Since there were many recommendations that dealt with detailed design of
moving buildings or spaces between buildings, Dick Schwartz, Project
• Architect, responded to each recommendation with proposed solutions. He
mentioned that by shifting buildings, eliminating some of the excess parking
area, and inclusion of a pathway system, the recommendations on the Staff
Report could be met.
Chairwoman Schee recommended action not be taken at this meeting because
two of the members (Brown & Sorenson) received their information packets on
this meeting late Monday rather than Friday (when received by other
Commission members) due to heavy police load over the weekend. The
Commission also requested that the representatives from Mark Z. Jones
Associates bring back a report on the recreational facilities included in this
project, and some concrete ideas about opening up the building areas as
suggested in the Staff Report. Mr. Schwartz felt this would be possible by the
next meeting, and asked that action be taken at that time to allow them to
begin some construction yet this year.
Action Taken:
Fosnocht moved and Brown seconded to hold over for two weeks the Shadow
Green proposal in Edenvale and take action at their next meeting on October 17,
1972. Motion carried.
B. The Preserve Highpoint, Addition Two, single family area in Phase I of
The Preserve . Requesting rezoning to RM 6.5 and preliminary plat approval
for the 15 single family lots.
Mr. Putnam briefly outlined the changes in the plat that were requested by
the Commission at their last meeting. The pedestrian pathway down the center
between the two cul-de-sacs was eliminated in favor of a pathway that would
PLANNING COMMISSION MINUTES
.4 October 3, 1972
Page Two
run along Neill Lake Road and connect to The Preserve pathway systems. This
seemed more logical and a better way to move the people. Secondly, lots 11
and 12 were made a greater depth, to about 170 ft. from 150 ft. Lots 3 and 4
were left the same depth because no other solution was possible in that the
houses were turned sideways to the road. The matter of lining up the driveways
with the Preferred Developer's project across the street was accomplished on
one driveway - the northerly driveway - but the geometrics would not allow the
second driveway to line up. Mr. Putnam pointed out that this was not the
best, but that if the single family area is to be developed, it was the only
alternative.
The Planner summarized that the utilization of this land for single family
necessitated this type of plan in that some of the things are not ideal, but
that it should be workable. He urged The Preserve in the future to spend more
planning time in working to insure that when alternate land uses are choseathat
they will in fact work with the pedestrian-auto systems within The Preserve.
Action Taken
Fosnocht moved and Schee seconded to recommend approval to the Council of
the rezoning to RM 6.5 for single family detached lots and preliminary plat
approval as presented in the revised plan. An amendment to this motion stated
that approval is contingent upon a public walkway which would serve this
. addition and would meet with Village Staffs approval and connect to The
Preserve system. Motion passed unanimously.
III. PETITIONS AND REQUESTS
A. William Dredge Property Subdivision on Summit Drive west of Red Rock Lake.
Mr. Putnam outlined the alternatives in this proposed subdivision by Mr.
Dredge. Mr. Dredge requested Village approval for a land division that would
establish 7 lots, some of which are sold, on his property. The Planner, in
working with Mr. Dredge, felt that the best solution would be to create 6 lots
in the same area, which is acceptable to Mr. Dredge. He has agreed to
dedicate a 60 ft. street right of way and cul-de-sac turnaround at the end of
Summit Drive, bringing that road to the same standard as Summit Drive to the
west. The land division will enable Mr. Dredge to have two buildable lots
of over 2 acre in size, one with 100 ft. frontage and the other with 75 ft.
frontage.
Action Taken
Brown moved and Boerger seconded to recommend approval to the Council of
the property subdivision with &Staff coordination of roadways and platting
design. Motion carried. Sorenson abstained.
B. Ecklund & Swedlund's Hidden Pond's 150 acre single family detached sub-
division located south of Duck Lake Trail, extending west to TH 101. Request
rezoning and preliminary plat approval of 150 acre proposal.
Dick Knutson of McCombs-Knutson Associates presented the proposal for the
Hidden Pond subdivision. He stressed the private parkway of about 25 acres
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PLANNING COMMMSION IdIINUTES
October 3 , 1972
Page Three
with connected ponds that would act as storm drainage areas as well as
esthetic beauty spots. He noted that nearly two miles of private trailways
would be included in the project. He also mentioned the diversity of lots
in that some would have very expensive homes and others would have housing
as low as $30,000. The variety of lots would offer lots that fronted on the
quasi-public parkway system, lots that were cul-de-sacs, and others that
were heavily wooded. Mr. Knutson addressed himself to the concerns that
were expressed in the Staff Report about the conflict with the Guide Plan and
the roads that go through the area, north to south and east to west, which are
major community streets. It was Mr. Knutson's feelings that the traffic on
the streets could be handled on Duck Lake Trail, West 62nd Street, and TH 5 ,
running east to west, and on TH 101 and Co. Rd. 4 for those north to south. He
did not feel that the parkway streets as proposed on the plan were necessary.
Mr. Swedlund stated that the intent of this development was to create the
single family homestead environment that would be free from the pressures of
higher density living. To achieve this, they have created 13 ,500 sq.ft.
and larger lots that would be secluded and would not have roadways running
through the neighborhoods nor would it have public parkways running through
the area. The inclusion of the public facilities would change the character
and may change his concept if they were included, according to Mr. Swedlund.
Mr. Knutson stressed that there seemed to be an impasse reached between the
• Village Planner, Mr. Swedlund, and himself, particularly over the matter of
inclusion of moderate cost housing that may be built on a smaller lot. They
stressed that the intent of this area was to provide a mix in housing from
$30,000 and up price range, which is what they feel Ecklund & Swedlund do
best. The townhouse or multiple housing is not what they want to do and
do not have the capabilities at this time to do so.
The Planner summarized his Staff Report, which noted the conflicts with the
1968 Guide Plan, the lack of the normal information presented in a PUD, and
the lack of a plan for the total area of Duck Lake/Round Lake similar to the
Red Rock area. The Planner mentioned that his basic concern was not the land
use decision for this area being single family detached; in fact, that would
probably be most appropriate. His concern is the method and the community
facilities included within this development and the housing price range . It
is his recommendation that Ecklund & Swedlund should approach this as a PUD
similar to that of the Round Lake Estates by Eliason Builders and that the
Planning Commission would prefer that type of presentation. At that point,
the Commission disagreed with the Planner, saying that they did not require
Mr. Eliason to proceed with the PUD but suggested it as an alternative, and
this would be the same feeling they would have to this project. Mr. Putnam
mentioned the matter of phasing this project, as a project of this scale could
in fact receive approval for a smaller first phase area located next to Duck Lake .
A preliminary plat formed prior to approval of the entire platting of the area
would entail a minimal amount of research and planning for the entire area so
that Mr. Swedlund could start building and have lots available yet this year or
early next year. This is not the choice of the applicant, to have a concept
sketch or plan for the entire area approved prior to the beginning of any project.
PLANNING COMMISSION MINUTES
October 3 , 1972
Page Four
In summary, it would seem to be a fair statement to say that the Commission
was in agreement with the basic idea of 13 ,500 sq.ft. single family detached
homes in this area, but were not sure at this point on several unresolved
matters, including the Guide Plan and also the exact plan as submitted.
Action Taken-
Soerger moved and Schee seconded to refer the proposal to the Park & Recreation
Commission, the Human Rights Commission, and to the Staff for a sector
planning study similar to that of Red Rock, which would deal with the major
circulation elements in the area and the surrounding land use of that area.
Motion carried.
C. Hirsch Development Corporation, townhouses and patio homes located
north of Olympic Hills Golf Course in The Preserve. Request rezoning and
first stage preliminary plat approval.
Don Ripple, site planner on the project, presented the concept for a mix of
townhouses and patio homes on this 25 acre site. He mentioned that they
had worked with numerous proposals with the Staff, and the proposal now of
180 units was considerably reduced from the 250 units originally considered.
The extreme slopes and the desired open space within the project were the
• primary reasons for the changes. Mr. Ripple outlined the concept of small
clusters of approximately 30 units each of patio homes or townhouses, and
the grouped open spaces with five separate play-intensive use areas. He
noted the pedestrian easement that is a major public pathway from Anderson
Lakes to Neill Lake and Purgatory Creek that runs through the project. The
Park & Recreation Commission has reviewed this proposal particularly as it
deals with the handling of the public pathways through the project and feels
that it is a workable solution.
Mr. Ripple pointed out that the cul-de-sac that begins on the high part of the
hill next to the East/West Parkway has approximately 60 units and is in
excess of 1,000 feet long. In working with the Staff, it was determined that
this would be a very difficult area to develop since access to West 62nd Street
would be less than desirable at the location proposed and that the length
and number of units on that private cul-de-sac are excessive. At this point,
many options were investigated and two were determined to be the best to
follow, both of which involve crossing the pathway to gain access to the
uphill units by way of Neill Lake Road. Dick Anderson of the Park & Recreation
Commission briefly reviewed this solution and generally agreed that it could
be handled if it is worked out with great care. Thirty to sixty units of traffic
crossing the pathway by the private cul-de-sac streets involves having either
one or two private streets that would cross the public pathway at grade.
• Mr. Ripple pointed out that the key here is the way the traffic is slowed down
to a stop on crossing those streets with bumps or cuts in the pavement, signs,
and also how the pedestrian movement was stopped or slowed down at this
point. Also, the provision of some amenities on this pathway - creating a plaza
for example, kiosks, sitting areas, mailbox, service telephone, etc. - would
be most appropriate in this area and necessary items on a public pathway.
PLANNING COMMISSION MINUTES
October 3, 1972
Page Five
40
The use of ballards and plantings to slow the traffic, particularly bicycle
traffic on the public pathway, so that it would not conflict with the automobile
would seem to be one solution. The question of one or two driveways across
this will be brought to the Park & Recreation Commission for their input and
likewise, the input of the Planning Commission. The developer, Mr. Hirsch,
is willing to develop either proposal. This plaza development would be at Mr.
Hirsch's expense and would benefit his project and would also include as
the project develops, the building in phases of a 4 ft. asphalt pathway
throughout the entire project on the Village right of way that would be dedicated
to the public.
Action Taken:
Fosnocht moved and Schee seconded to refer to Staff for a report and to set
a public hearing date for October 24, 1972. Motion carried.
D. Preferred Developers Corporation, Meadow Wood's 180 unit rental apartment
project located in The Preserve west of the proposed Community Center.
Mr. Bill Bonner from The Preserve pointed out the location of the project on a
high, triangular knoll overlooking the Community Center. Mr. Bonner
summarized the building as being a double-loaded corridor, three story with
underground parking, rental apartment building with apartments renting from
• $185 to $225 for a 2 bedroom unit. An interior pool and court area with
recreation room, sauna, etc, would be provided with deck space overlooking
the lake. Also a developed interior court of the building would be a plus
feature of this project. Open field recreations space would be provided in
the meadow just south of the East/VVest Parkway and also in the areas around
Neill Lake.
The Planner asked why, since the density on this project is close to 18 units
per acre and is the same type building and structure as , for instance, the
Shadow Green project which has a density of approximately 15 units per acre,
the extra density in this case should be provided in that building type.
Perhaps the inclusion of extra interior parking spaces to free up more of the
site might be a reason for the increased density or extra added amenities. He
asked that the developers address themselves to this question of a bonus
arrangement as the densities increase in apartment projects.
Action Taken:
Brown moved and Schee seconded to refer to .Staff for a report and recommenda-
tion and to set public hearing for October 24, 1972. Motion carried.
E. Warren Shultz, single family plat located on Co. Rd. 4 between Kurtz Lane
and Park Terrace Drive.
Mr. David Husby of Rieke, Carroll, Muller and Associates presented the
proposed plat by Warren Shultz in this area. The plat includes a publicly
PLANNING COMMISSION MINUTES
October 3 , 1972
Page Six
dedicated street that would serve the five lots, all of which are over 13 ,500
sq.ft. and that screening - some type of bush or trees - would be provided -
along the south side of the proposed street for the back yards of the homeowners
to the south.
Action Taken
Schee moved and Boerger seconded to recommend approval to the Council of the
Warren Shultz single family plat with the recommendation including the Staff
Report of 9/15/72, with a change in the wording of Recommendation 4 to c ange
the word "asked" to "insist" and "should" to "must" . Four voted aye, anc
Fosnocht and Sorenson abstained. Motion carried.
Meeting adjourned at 11:45 p.m.
Respectfully submitted, Wayne Brown, Secretary - by RP.
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