HomeMy WebLinkAboutFlying Cloud Airport Advisory Commission - 07/11/2019APPROVED MINUTES
FLYING CLOUD AIRPORT ADVISORY COMMISSION
THURSDAY, JULY 11, 2019 7:00 P.M., CITY CENTER
HERITAGE ROOM I
8080 Mitchell Road
COMMISSION MEMBERS PRESENT: Chair, Keith Tschohl; Vice Chair, Bob
Barker; Daniel Dorson; Kurt Schendel;
Mike Wilson
COMMISSION MEMBERS ABSENT: Kurt Schendel
STUDENT REPRESENTATIVES: Evelyn Hemler
Troy Johnson
Amogh Kalyanam
STAFF: Scott Gerber, EP Fire Chief; Jan Curielli,
City Recorder
GUESTS: Jennifer Lewis, MAC Representative;
Robert Dockery, MAC representative;
Glenn Weibel, Volunteer with MAC;
Michael Lawrence, Operations Manager for
Premier; Cindi and Jeff Middaugh,
residents; Linda Wegner, resident; Mary
Meier, Resident: Joe Flerschacker, resident
of Mound, MN; Laura Hermann, resident of
St. Bonifacius; Lynn Ojala, resident; George
Kalogerson, resident;
I. CALL TO ORDER/ROLL CALL
Chair Tschohl called the meeting to order at 7:01 P.M.
II. APPROVAL OF AGENDA
MOTION: Kiely moved, seconded by Schendel, to approve the agenda as published.
Motion carried 5-0.
III. PUBLIC COMMENT
(See Item V.A.)
IV. APPROVAL OF MINUTES
A. COMMISSION MEETING HELD THURSDAY, APRIL 11, 2019
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July 11, 2019
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Ms Lewis said on Page 7, Paragraph 3, the reference to agreements made with St.
Paul and South St. Paul was incorrect. The agreement was with St. Paul only.
Wilson said the number of overweight aircraft on Page 5 should be four, not eight.
MOTION: Kiely moved, seconded by Schendel, to approve the minutes of the
April 11, 2019, meeting as amended. Motion carried 5-0.
V. STANDING DISCUSSION ITEMS
A. NOISE REPORT--MAC
Ms Lewis distributed copies of the Second Quarter 2019 MAC Reliever Airport
Operations and Noise Complaint Report. She reported Flying Cloud Airport
(FCM) had 30.8% of the operations during the quarter and received 52.7% of the
noise complaints. Those numbers were higher than during the second quarter of
2018. She noted there is usually an increase in the second and third quarters of the
year, compared to the first and fourth quarters. The complaints came from 59
locations, primarily to the east and west of the airport, and was an increase over
the 33 complaint locations in the first quarter. She said FCM is the busiest reliever
airport in the MAC system. There was a slight increase in nighttime operations
during the quarter, with a sizable increase in the number of nighttime complaints.
She suggested some of the increase in complaints could be attributed to people
wanting to sleep with the windows open and being disturbed by the late night and
early morning flights.
In response to a request from the Commission regarding how many nighttime
operations are related to medical activities, she reviewed the statistics she
compiled for known FCM medical flights by hour from 10:00 PM to 6 AM:
Hour Percent Medical
10:00 PM 32%
11:00 PM 36%
12:00 AM 41%
1:00 AM 57%
2:00 AM 83%
3:00 AM 90%
4:00 AM 87%
5:00 AM 52%
6:00 AM 15%
She explained the compilation showed a large number of unknown flights from
10:00 PM to 12:00 AM. Much of that activity could be attributed to flight training
because pilots are required to fly a certain number of hours after sunset.
Barker asked about the percentage overall for the medical operations during
nighttime hours. Ms Lewis responded she did not have that figure, but the hours
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from 1:00 AM to 5:00 AM have the most medical flights, and those are the core
nighttime flights. Barker asked if there may be other medical flights by transient
operators. Ms Lewis responded that is difficult to know, but she assumed there are
a variety of operations during that time frame.
Lynn Ojala, 10012 Indigo Drive, asked why the medical flights choose to fly to
and from Eden Prairie. Ms Lewis replied it may be because of proximity to
hospitals near Eden Prairie.
Tschohl asked if the medical operations out of FCM are typically fixed wing
charter operations for transplant operations. Ms Lewis said that was correct.
Laura Hermann, St. Bonifacius, asked if any of the flights included in the
statistics might be overflights and not related to FCM operations. Ms Lewis
responded her office does get complaints about medical operations activity that
does not operate out of FCM, but those flights are not included in the noise report
for FCM. Barker asked if Ms Lewis included in her report only the medical flights
with flight plans starting or ending at FCM. Ms Lewis replied that was correct.
George Kalogerson, 8596 Norwood Circle, asked if there was a change in the
number of complaints when the north runway was closed and being rebuilt. Ms
Lewis believed that was a contributing factor to the increased number of
complaints, especially for June.
Cindi Middaugh, 9516 Creek Knoll Rd., noted at the last meeting Ms Lewis
explained the letters sent to operators who do not follow the procedures for noise
control and asked if Ms Lewis had seen a decrease in repeat offenders in the
second quarter. Ms Lewis said they have some operators who are often repeat
offenders. For the month of June, she did not see any operators who had
previously received a letter from her office. Barker noted the nighttime noise
restrictions at FCM are voluntary. The pilots, operators and the tower work
together on the noise restrictions, but those restrictions are not mandatory.
Tschohl noted the procedures would be considered best practices.
Tschohl noted there seemed to be a change in the distribution on the complaint
map with more coming from the northeast and also to the east past Homeward
Hills Rd. He asked if Ms Lewis had any sense as to what type of operations
triggered those complaints. Ms Lewis explained there were some households in
that area who have complained in the past, but there were additional households
this quarter. She spoke with two residents in that area who had complained. She
got the sense they wanted to sleep with the windows open and would like less
frequent nighttime operations over their homes.
Mary Meier, 11135 Jackson Drive, said there were six or seven flights over her
deck tonight as they tried to eat dinner outside, and that happens all the time in the
evening hours. She noted she is not one of those who phoned in complaints about
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the flights, so the number of complaints would have been higher if she had done
so.
Jeff Middaugh, 9516 Creek Knoll Rd., asked if the airport can monitor flight
altitudes because the aircraft seem to be very close to the houses. Ms Lewis
replied the flight tracking system collects the data based on the radar data track
which shows altitude and any identity information. Air traffic control directs air
traffic when they are in operation. She noted the traffic pattern altitude is to be
1000 feet above ground. Kiely explained the goal is for aircraft to operate in a
rectangular pattern and to start at 400-500 feet, make their turn and then go up to
1000 feet; however, Air traffic control may adjust the pattern. Wilson noted there
is no required minimum altitude to make the pattern for aircraft landing. Barker
further noted the traffic pattern would relate to propeller-type aircraft, probably
for training purposes.
Ms Meier asked what the neighbors could expect in terms of relief from the noise
and the increased number of flights. Tschohl explained this is a complex question
because there are a lot of layers of interaction and multiple units involved in
airport activities. The FAA has jurisdiction over the air space, and the MAC does
what they can to accommodate the concerns of the neighbors through such actions
as periodic noise studies and pilot seminars; however, there is not much that can
be done except to try to educate airport users on the voluntary restrictions.
Linda Wegner, 10061 Purgatory Road, commented the constant jet flights are the
problem in her neighborhood. Barker replied the FAA-established threshold takes
into consideration the amplitude as well as frequency of flights. The noise
threshold level is contained within the boundary of the airport property, so the
noise volume in areas outside of the airport property probably does not meet the
threshold limit. He noted all of the Commission members experience the same
things because we all live in Eden Prairie. The Commission can work with the
operators, and a couple of years ago we worked with helicopter operators to move
some of their training operations to less populated areas. The Commission
members are here to try to find some creative ways to reduce the impact.
Wilson noted the Commission did have a success with the helicopters. The
problem is that FCM has a lot of jet aircraft, training aircraft and helicopters, so
the mix of aircraft causes a lot of complaints. He noted they ran a noise seminar
two weeks ago and talked to pilots about the noise restrictions. There is currently
a huge increase in pilot training taking place nationwide because of the industry-
wide pilot shortage, so training will continue for the foreseeable future.
Ms Middaugh asked if there is any particular day when training occurs. Wilson
replied it happens all the time.
Ms Ojala commented the heat affects aircraft operations and noise levels. Ms
Hermann agreed both heat and weight make a big difference in the altitudes of
aircraft. She noted aircraft operators also like to fly near their homes.
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Ms Ojala asked if jet aircraft are not as low flying. Tschohl replied they may be
lower. Ms Ojala then commented departures seem louder from her perspective.
Glenn Weibel, pilot and MAC volunteer, said he flies jets out of FCM and always
tries to meet the noise requirements. He noted flying to the west out of FCM is a
challenge, and temperatures and humidity make a great difference. Jets must be
handled differently in the summertime. Pilots cannot do anything to negate the
noise; however, jets today are designed to be much quieter than they were 15
years ago. He noted the south runway is not long enough for some jets to use, so
most jets take off from the north runway. All airports have the same challenge
regarding noise when the weather is hot.
Ms Meier noted FCM seems to have a lot of volume, and asked if there is anyway
the number of flights could be lowered. Michael Lawrence, Operations Manager
for Premier Jet Center, replied a lot of people want to use FCM because they like
to fly out of an airport near them. Wilson commented FCM is in a beautiful
residential area, and people who live in the area want to use this airport. The
MAC cannot force people to use another airport. There are a lot of big businesses
in this area, and they want the convenience of flying from FCM.
B. ORDINANCE 97 MONITORING—MAC
Wilson said his boss has retired, and Joe Harris was promoted into the role of
Director of Reliever Airports two weeks ago. Wilson will transition to St. Paul
and Lake Elmo as well as Airlake and FCM. Robert Dockery will be helping out
at FCM and Airlake. Mr. Harris and he are trying to get a handle on what letters
have gone out and where we are in the process.
He reported seven aircraft were over the 60,000-pound limit during the quarter,
one of whom was a repeat offender. Letters will be sent out to those operators.
Barker asked if there is any discussion about changing the letter regarding the
Ordinance 97 violation, because the Commission wants to keep apprised of that
discussion. Wilson replied the discussion will be about what the letters are and the
process we have used. They want to look at the process and see which repeat
offender has not received a second letter. Barker noted it would be helpful to put
this on the Commission’s agenda for the next meeting so we will know what will
be done if there is a repeat offender. He would like a report on the process to help
the Commission know what the action will be for such offences.
C. AIRPORT INCIDENTS AND OPERATIONAL UPDATES—MAC
Wilson said construction is now complete on the two taxiways at FCM. There
were minor changes made as part of the runway project. They will be looking at
some modifications in order to use funds remaining from the construction project.
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Wilson reported two incidents during the quarter: one involved smoke in the
cockpit and was responded to by both Eden Prairie Police and Fire Departments;
the second was a flat tire on an aircraft.
Kiely asked if the issues regarding lining up with the runway have been cleared
up. Wilson replied there are always such issues. They had some issues with the
circuit boards for the reils, and there were incidents of wrong runway use when
the reils were down. They will be looking at some modifications to the taxiways
and run-up pads. He said the Runway Safety Action Team (RSAT) met recently,
and that group is looking at some other modifications. Barker noted he attended
the RSAT meeting. He believed the RSAT is a good forum for ideas and asked if
there is a document that summarizes the meeting and pulls together all the ideas
put forth along with who will be tasked with those. Wilson said he hasn’t seen
that report yet and suggested he contact Mr. Dockery about it.
Regarding the incident of smoke in the cockpit, Fire Chief Gerber reported things
went very smoothly. Eden Prairie has a seamless operation to respond when an
incident occurs at the airport. Wilson noted the City of Eden Prairie has been
phenomenal in their efforts to learn about the airport.
VI. OTHER OLD BUSINESS
A. RECAP OF MINNEAPOLIS TOWER AND TRACON TOUR
Kiely reported the Commission members who took the tour of the MSP control
tower and TRACON asked what is done about noise abatement. They responded
that safety was their absolute goal. There are only certain corridors where they
can put planes, and noise abatement is not at the top of their list.
Barker commented it was impressive to see how complex it is to manage the
amount of traffic at MSP along with traffic at the reliever airports.
Tschohl said their purpose is to separate aircraft and keep aircraft safe while
moving them efficiently. They will help with other things, but their primary
purpose is safety.
B. RECAP OF SUMMER 2019 MAC PILOT MEETING
Tschohl noted Ms Lewis and he held the meeting about four weeks ago. Ms
Lewis reported a good discussion took place at the meeting. Most of the pilots had
been to such briefings in the past, and most of them understand the need to keep
noise levels down. It is important to share an understanding of the residents’
concerns and the pilots’ responsibilities.
Ms Lewis noted they hosted an open house at the airport viewing area on June 25.
Aircraft operators and others attended, but not a lot of residents who are not also
pilots. They will host another open house and will expand the mailing list. Eighty
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postcards went out, and they targeted homeowners’ associations to the east, north
and west of the airport. They wanted to get a good feel for how the event would
work with the ball park activities going on at the same time and sharing the
parking lot. They plan to expand the number of invitations that are sent out for the
next open house.
Schendel asked if the event was advertised in the Eden Prairie News. Ms Lewis
said it was and was also included on the Eden Prairie calendar on the website.
Barker noted the aircraft viewing area is new, and we are trying to learn the best
way to use that amenity.
VII. NEW BUSINESS
A. STAKEHOLDER ENGAGEMENT -- MAC
B. ORGANIZATIONAL UPDATE – MAC
(See Item VII.B and C)
C. REGULATORY CHANGES FOR RECREATIONAL USE OF
UNMANNED AIRCRAFT
Tschohl said regulatory changes have been made regarding the use of unmanned
recreational aircraft (drones). The text of the law makes it more difficult for those
unmanned aircraft to operate within Eden Prairie. He said FCM is considered a
Class D air space, and operators of unmanned aircraft need to get advance
permission from the FAA to operate within most areas of the City. A new
authorization capability becomes available on July 25 requiring operators to use
an app to request permission to operate up to a certain altitude, which varies from
50-400 feet depending on the distance from the airport. There will be other
regulatory changes during the summer, and an online test is being developed for
operators of the recreational drones. Tschohl further explained the law is live now
for licensed operators, but will go live in two weeks for unlicensed operators
nationwide.
C. UPCOMING EVENTS AND TOPICS FOR FUTURE FCAAC MEETINGS
1. UWotN Air Expo (July 13-14, 2019)
Wilson reviewed the aircraft that will participate in this year’s Air Expo.
He noted the Red Bull parachute team will be performing a couple of
times.
Tschohl asked if there is any notice regarding air space restriction. Wilson
replied the only one is for the parachute team performances.
2. Girls In Aviation Day (September 21, 2019
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Ms Ojala noted there will be more things included in this year’s event.
3. 2019 Airport Tour (Rescheduled; Date TBD)
Tschohl said the spring tour was cancelled and needs to be rescheduled.
He thought it best to do the airport tour when the new Student
Commissioners are in attendance, so he suggested planning the tour for
October or November.
4. Review Flying Cloud LTCP Draft (Date TBD)
5. Additional Technical Noise/Environmental Topics As Requested
(TBD)
IX. ADJOURNMENT
A. NEXT COMMISSION MEETING—OCTOBER 10, 2019
MOTION: Kiely moved, seconded by Barker, to adjourn the meeting. Motion carried
5-0. Chair Tschohl adjourned the meeting at 8:10 p.m.