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HomeMy WebLinkAboutCity Council - 03/10/1987 - Special Meeting APPROVED MINUTES EDEN PRAIRIE CITY COUNCIL SPECIAL MEETING TUESDAY, MARCH 10, 1987 3 : 00 PM, CITY HALL LUNCHROOM COUNCIL MEMBERS: Mayor Gary Peterson, Richard Anderson George Bentley, Jean Harris and Patricia Pidc oc k CITY COUNCIL STAFF: City Manager Carl J . Jullie , Planning Director Chris Enger, Director of Community Services Robert Lambert, Director of Public Works Eugene A . Dietz, and Recording Secretary Jan Nelson ROLL CALL: All members were present . Mayor Peterson called the meeting to order at 3: 05 PM . Director of Community Services Lambert reviewed his memo of March 2, 1987, regarding Eden Prairie Trails System Issues . He said there are three trail designations that need to be discussed today: nature trails, sidewalks and transportation trails . Regarding nature trails, he said they are suggesting that the developer rough grade the trail, sign it and then do minimal maintenance until such time as the trail can be linked up to another trail section. Peterson noted that there are areas of the creek corridor where rough grading of the trail would be nearly impossible ; therefore , y he thought we need to know for sure that that particular section of Y corridor will eventually be part of the trail system. Lambert said he thought the issue of where the trail will go in the creek valley should be the topic for a separate meeting. f Anderson said he believes we have to define some policies for our various types of trails . He noted that there are bus stops where there are no sidewalks along the street, and there are high density residential areas where no sidewalks exist . He said we need a de- fined policy for Staff to go by for trails and sidewalks in the City when plans come in for development . Harris asked if we have effectively been barred from developing trails in areas previously identified for future development once development is initiated or completed . Lambert responded that there is a question that we will be able to put in the trail along Purgatory Creek in the Edenvale area where it has always been planned because several residents are opposed to the trail . He also said development of the area on the north shore of City Council Minutes -2- March 10, 1987 Red Rock Lake caused problems with the location of a trail that was to lead up to the Central Middle School, and we decided to not com- plete that section of trail . Pidcock said she was not aware of the option to run the trail around Red Rock Lake . Lambert said they addressed whether it would follow the marsh around the lake along the backyards of the houses or whether it would go up through a cul-de-sac ; ultimately it was de- cided to not complete the trail in that section at all . Anderson said that is a problem as we ended up with a dead-end trail because we didn't stake out the trail and put a sign for the planned trail . He said our trail and sidewalk system in the City is piece- meal , and we have not followed through on the priorities set in 1975 by the Hikeway/Bikeway task force . Lambert commented that we are a lot further along on our planned trail system than most cities . He said we have completed 3/4 to 4/5 of the spine system proposed in the 1975 study . Anderson said after the recent bond issue the citizens surveyed said the number one recreation item wanted was trails, and he believes we have to respond to that . Regarding the Red Rock Lake trail, Harris asked if the City owned any of the land for the trail . Lambert responded that we have a problem in obtaining; land as we do not opt to take the area for -the trail in lieu of cash park fees , since the cash park fees are used to build neighborhood parks . He said it is a matter of not being able to have both land f or trails and neighborhood parks. Pidcock noted that in 1975 when Red Rock Park went in, the developer was forced to give land for the trail system. She said it is incon- sistent to say now that we can't go all the way around the lake with the trail . Peterson said that was a decision this Council made . Pidcock said the decision we made was to not bring it up from the lake . A discussion followed regarding the previous Council decision about the Red Rock Lake trail .. Anderson noted that surrounding communities have made decisions to have trails alongside or adjacent to homes and often the people are disturbed about it ; however, the point is that for the total good of the people in the area, they have put through the easements to access a park or another facility. Lambert said the majority of nature trails are on City land and are on an area designated as a trail corridor. He said he thought the a toughest issue will be the trail along the lower Purgatory Creels valley because it is environmentally sensitive . City Council Minutes -3- March 10, 1987 Anderson noted that we have seen where the City of Blooming-con has taken a creek corridor and turned it into an aesthetically pleasing asset to the community . He said we have that opportunity now, but we may not for much longer. Harris said she thought it is vitally important to preserve the lower creek valley as a resource for us and future generations, and to provide the kind of trail discussed during the trail tour on Saturday. She asked what the status is of the areas not yet controlled by the City. Lambert reviewed the history of acquiring the land in the lower creek valley. He said the slopes have become either scenic easements or outlots on areas already acquired . Peterson asked if we have done anything towards a Feasibility Study to detail what portion of this entire corridor could be served by trails . Lambert said it would be possible to put a trail along the entire length but there are areas further up that are marshy and might require a boardwalk . Pidcock asked if getting developers to donate the land in the creek valley wouldn' t be more valuable than their giving cash park fees . Lambert said this is a difficult decision and it is really two dif- ferent issues . He said he thought it would be best to continue our current policy as most owners would prefer the write-off for donating the land to having to maintain the creek slopes . Bentley said he thought it was feasible to look at this issue as two separate components: obtaining the property; and the trail that would go through the property . He said we can' t build the trail until we own the property so the first issue is getting dedication of the remaining parcels. After that we can deal with the question of exactly where the trail can go and where it will cross the creek. Peterson asked for clarification on Staff' s understanding of the direction of the Council regarding the creek corridor . Lambert said he believes the understanding is that we want to acquire the entire creek corridor for the potential of putting a trail in the corridor, whether it is put in now or 50 years from now. Anderson said he thought we have to make a commitment on the creek corridor in the Welter property. He said when property comes in that has potential for the City, those opportunities should be brought up and discussed . Peterson said he thought before we begin to decide where the trail will be placed or bridges constructed we need to acquire the entire length of the corridor and do a major study on the precise location of the trail. He said he didn't think that anyone could believe that the Council has been soft on getting land along the corridor . City Council Minutes - - March 10, 1987 s Anderson said he was concerned that we are getting enough land for the potential trail rather than just preserving the 100-year flood-- plain area . Harris said she thought the policy of acquiring the entire corridor for the potential of a trail is an appropriate position at this time , and that the Council should articulate this as a policy and move on to other issues . Lambert said we have been requiring developers to dedicate the flood- plain and either scenic easements or dedication of the creek slopes, despite the fact there is no ordinance to require anything more than the dedication of the floodplain. He said a trail will work in the floodplain in some areas, but in other areas more land will be re- quired in order to construct the trail on dry land . Anderson said he doesn ' t want to reach the point where we say we don't fi have enought land to complete a trail, and noted that a portion of the trail along the Welter property will require obtaining an additional 100 feet of land . k Pidcock asked if it would be possible to acquire enough land to put the neighborhood parks on the dedicated land . Lambert said many of the parks are already built and noted that land such as that would represent very expensive lots . If there was consensus, Bentley said he would suggest adopting a procedure such as the following relative to the lower Purgatory Creek valley: 1 . Have Staff define the creek corridor they would like to see designated as a corridor ; Y 2 . Have Staff bring the planned corridor to the Council for debate and vote ; 3 . Maintain an aggressive policy of obtaining the remaining creek corridor while developing a Feasibility Study on the trail system itself . i Peterson said he thought this was in fact what we had been doing. Bentley said this would establish a coherent policy to formalize what we are already doing. Peterson asked what he meant by the creek corridor. Bentley replied that Staff would bring back the plan for the corridor that would specify the actual amount of land to be included in the designated corridor. Bentley said a specific policy may help in negotiating with land- owners or in cases of contested issues. Anderson said he hoped the ` City Council Minutes -5- March 10, 1987 aggressive policy includes getting title to the outlots not yet deeded to the City so that we don' t lose what we already have . He said he thought it was important to designate the trails by signa.ge and mowing the grass . MOTION: Bentley moved, seconded by Harris , to direct Staff to for- mulate the procedure outlined above and return to the Council with a written description for further discussion and action. Peterson asked what Staff would have to do in order to designate a corridor . Lambert said there would be a map with precise designa- tions and descriptions . Harris asked about the possibility of acquiring the extra land needed for the trail in the marshy areas of the upper valley . Lambert said that land will probably have to be purchased outside the floodplain as an alternative to filling in portions of the floodplain. Anderson noted that we also nave the option to take 10% of the property rather than cash park fees as we have done in the past . VOTE ON THE MOTION: Motion carried unanimously. MOTION: Bentley moved, seconded by Anderson, to direct Staff to draft a policy that nature trails will be roughed in and signed at the time of development and that low-grade maintenance of the trail will be performed until a connection is made to the trail system, and to bring the draft policy back to the Council for discussion and action. Motion carried unanimously. Lambert noted that another issue is transportation trails , both on existing streets and on new streets . He said the tough issue is how to pay for portions of the trail system along existing streets that need to be constructed . He said for the first few years we got government grants for up to 90% of the cost to put them in, however, that money dried up and we have just been putting in short segments as money becomes available . He said, further, that several years ago the Council decided not to use cash park fees to build transporta- tion trails . Pidcock asked if a subsequent Council could change that decision. Lambert said it could be changed . 7 Anderson noted that the fees are an important means of funding and that other communities such as Lakeville are adding a small percent- age for a community-wide trail system along with the usual park fee . He said we have to find a means to fund our trail system. Lambert replied that he didn' t know what legal basis those communities are using to assess that kind of fee , but he will ask the City Attorney about that . i j City Council Minutes -6- March 10, 1987 Lambert said it would also be possible to assess the general popula- tion 1/2 mill per year until the park and trail system is completed . MOTION: Anderson moved, seconded by Bentley, to direct Staff to present information on the options available for funding the trans- portation trail system. Motion carried unanimously. A discussion followed regarding the history of relying on Homeowners ' Associations for building and maintaining sidewalks and/or trail systems within their project area. Director of Public Works Dietz reviewed his memo of March 10, 1987 regarding sidewalks . He said there are three issues that need to be discussed : sidewalks in new subdivisions ; those to be constructed in existing subdivisions ; and the sidewalk along Woodland Drive . He said he had tried to expand a little on the criteria we currently use for sidewalks . Bentley asked if there has ever been an attempt to make a more specific functional classification of City-owned roadways . Dietz said as far as he knows there has not, but he would identify four classifications: collector; low-level locals ; residential streets; and cul-de-sacs . Bentley said he thought through streets might be another category as they are not collectors but do go through one or more neighborhoods . He said the point of this was to define the roads so that we can specify if sidewalks will be required or not, and if so, on one or both sides . He said this would facilitate dealings with developers of new property as they would know what was expected of them.. Anderson said he agreed with this concept and would put streets into three categories : collectors ; through streets ; and residential streets. Dietz said the purpose of his memo was to present alternatives as to sidewalks on both sides of all new streets, sidewalks on both sides except on cul-de-sacs, and the present plan of sidewalks on one side generally, with both sides occasionally . Peterson said he hoped the option would come down to continuing the present plan with a more careful definition or delineation. He said he thought this could almost be reduced to a formula so there wouldn't have to be a lot of value judgments required . Dietz said we got started talking about sidewalks because there were a number of requests for stop signs in certain areas . He said it was k concluded that it is not a good idea to put stop signs indiscriminately through neighborhoods . He said one of the things he noted is that there is no good place for kids to play, and this contributes to the complaints regarding heavy traffic through neighborhoods. Peterson �I said that those complaints will no doubt continue, but he doesn't be- lieve that sidewalks represent good play areas for children beyond a certain age . City Council Minutes -7- March 10 , 1987 Bentley said he was talking about a somewhat different approach to Point A of the memo regarding present criteria. He said he was suggesting that Staff return with a number of functional classifi- cations of roadways, the definition of those functional classifica- tions, and what type of pedestrian systems should go along with each of the classifications . He said it doesn't have to reflect what we have done or what we are currently doing, but rather is an oppor- tunity to take a look at what problems exist currently and correct that in future development . Dietz said he understood the consensus to be the traffic volume as the primary basis for classification with some consideration of the number of houses . Peterson said he thought proximity to major attrac- tions such as parks should also be considered . Anderson said he agreed with that and was concerned that sometimes residential streets can become through streets after development is completed in sur- rounding areas . Dietz asked if the consensus was to limit the sidewalks to one side of the street where possible . A discussion followed regarding the classifications suggested and the number of sidewalks required for each type . �( Anderson said he thought the real problem with pedestrians occurs ,.. when traffic parks along the roads so that children are behind ? cars when they play. He said we should take a look at restricting parking on through streets to one side of the street in developed areas . Dietz said that might solve the dart-out and visibility p problems ; but the more parked cars on a street , the slower the traffic hasto go, so part of the problem of speed is controlled on those streets . Anderson said another part of the problem occurs with bike riders who must maneuver around parked cars in the street . He said he thought no parking signs on one side of the street would help to solve a lot of those problems. Bentley asked if a night-time parking ban in the City would have an effect on the day-time parking situation as well . Dietz said it probably would as people will do the most convenient thing and will make an effort to get cars off the street . Bentley said a variety of parking restrictions would be confusing and hard to enforce ; whereas a night-time ban might be easier to enforce and more con- sistent . Dietz said most of the major roadways have no parking because of the width required for the street. Anderson said he thought this could be extended throughout the City on other roads . A discussion followed regarding the criteria for parking restrictions and the effectiveness of such restrictions . z City Council Minutes -8- March 10 : 1987 Peterson said the issue of bicycle safety is an important issue not on the Agenda and we might want to schedule another work session on M that . Anderson said he was talking about the general safety of pedes- trians and bicyclists on streets that don't have sidewalks . Jullie suggested that we look at the street system and come up with some recommendations for such problems . Lambert asked if five-foot concrete sidewalk construction would be part of the issue involved with funding of transportation trails . The consensus was that it would be part of the funding issue . Anderson said he thought it was imperative to get crossings and a trail on both sides of Anderson Lakes Parkway before the new school opens this fall . Lambert said there is an underpass available . Anderson said there is no sidewalk on the south side of the street and he was concerned about that . Dietz said he still is not sure what to do about the Feasibility Study for the sidewalk on Woodland Drive as he cannot come up with an equitable means of funding the sidewalk and none of the residents seem to want the sidewalk at this time . He said he would suggest that we let that sidewalk proposal die and, if we receive a petition from 45-50% of the residents there for a sidewalk, then we go for it . A discussion followed regarding funding for the sidewalk if it were constructed . Lambert introduced Barb Cross who is the park planner and landscape + architect for the City. } MOTION: Harris moved , seconded by Pidcock, to adjourn the meeting at 5: 03 PM .